REWORK
A podcast by 37signals about the better way to work and run your business. The REWORK podcast features the co-founders of 37signals (the makers of Basecamp and HEY), Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sharing their unique perspective on business and entrepreneurship along with host Kimberly Rhodes.
S2 E150 · Wed, April 16, 2025
Picking Priorities
How do you decide what to work on next, without relying on a long, stale to-do list? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about why they don’t rely on lengthy roadmaps to set priorities. Instead, they focus on what makes sense now, not what seemed like a good idea months ago. They explain how working in real time leads to better decisions and thinking that fits the moment. Key Takeaways: 00:44 – Priorities aren’t permanent—they’re meant to shift as you learn 03:20 – Ditch the roadmap mentality in favor of real-time decision-making 07:20 – There’s a difference between winging it and planning as you go 09:10 – Why 6-week cycles give you just enough structure without locking you in Links and Resources: “Doing what you think, not what you thought” from Jason Fried’s HEY World Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY REWORK podcast merch The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E149 · Wed, April 09, 2025
Building On the Side
Have a day job but dreaming of launching the next big thing? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , a listener question sparks a conversation with 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson about juggling consulting work while building products on the side. They share real talk about timing, expectations, motivation — and why your side project should serve you, even if it doesn’t turn into a smash hit. Key Takeaways: 00:12 – Host Kimberly Rhodes reads a listener question about balancing consulting with product building 01:01 – Why it’s easier than ever to build something—but harder than ever to get noticed 05:48 – The barrier to entry is low, but staying in the game is the hard part 08:05 – There’s no formula for what will take off and what won’t 13:08 – Aim for more than just small wins—set bold goals 16:04 – You have to be fully invested if you want your idea to stand a chance Links and Resources: Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY REWORK podcast merch The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E148 · Wed, April 02, 2025
Why we choose profit
In a world where constant reinvestment is celebrated, 37signals chooses profit. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about how profit gives them freedom, clarity, and staying power—not just for the company, but for their customers too. They make the case for building a business that’s solid, simple, and self-funded. Key Takeaways: 00:27 – How being profitable is actually a choice 08:34 – Why it’s important to take money off the table 11:35 – Striking the right balance between ego and humility 15:00 – Profitability isn’t guaranteed forever 18:27 – Well-managed profits create reliability for customers Links and Resources: Why We Choose Profit Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E147 · Wed, March 26, 2025
Build a business that runs without you
Can you build a company that thrives even when you’re not in the room? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about the jobs they've created for themselves and how they're able to step away without progress coming to a halt. They discuss the fine line between being involved and letting the team run things without them. Key Takeaways: 00:14 – The importance of creating a job for yourself that you enjoy 02:45 – The tragedy of owning a business you don't love 06:56 – Staying relevant in your business and knowing when to step in 15:14 – Knowing when to step back so your team can grow 17:51 – Maintaining a life outside of your business and having work/life balance 20:36 – The parts of the business that require the founders' involvement 23:33 – Jason and David's stance of not being serial entrepreneurs Links and Resources: Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E146 · Wed, March 19, 2025
Increasing Capacity
How do you do more without growing your team substantially? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share how they’re expanding their product lineup while keeping their team lean. They reflect on how their approach to building software has evolved, and how pushing into the unknown makes the work more exciting. Key Takeaways 00:28 – How 37signals’ product lineup has evolved over time 08:00 – Why the company is adding a product designer to the team 15:07 – Finding the “fun” in creating new products 18:50 – Challenging yourself by stepping into the unknown 23:16 – Using real products as a way to do research and development Links and Resources: We're hiring a Product Designer! Find out about future job openings at 37signals Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E145 · Wed, March 12, 2025
Roles at the company, staying involved as a founder & other listener questions
Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson answer listener questions in this episode of The REWORK Podcast . They discuss the roles 37signals hires for (and the ones they don’t), the importance of staying accessible as a founder, and the thought process behind choosing a business structure. Key Takeaways 00:16 – Employee roles at 37signals 04:33 – How non-programmers contribute to programming 16:44 – Techniques for writing job descriptions 18:47 – Tips for being an accessible founder 25:22 – Deciding on a business structure Links and Resources: We're hiring a Product Designer! Find out about future job openings at 37signals Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E144 · Wed, March 05, 2025
Bringing Back Free
37signals' co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson are back to talk about the ins and outs of offering a product for free. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , they break down why they decided to reintroduce a free Basecamp plan, how offering free access can actually drive sales, and balancing analytics with instincts. Key Takeaways: 00:45 – The original philosophy behind Basecamp’s free plan 03:14 – Going beyond the free trial 07:36 – Tracking analytics without getting lost in the numbers 12:48 – The true cost of offering something for free 19:13 – Pricing strategies for new products 37signals is building Links and Resources: Get Basecamp for free at Basecamp.com Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E143 · Wed, February 12, 2025
Managing vs. Mentoring
There are no full-time managers at 37signals, but that doesn't mean the company is void of mentorship. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , host Kimberly Rhodes chats with Principal Programmer Jeffrey Hardy as he breaks down the company’s focus on peer-to-peer mentorship. They discuss hiring practices that allow for less management and what mentorship looks like amongst the team. Key Takeaways: 00:42 – Meet Jeffrey Hardy, Principal Programmer 02:09 – The evolution of 37signals' management structure 05:19 – Replacing managers with mentors 10:53 – How hiring impacts the ability to operate without managers 13:35 – The power of seeking entrepreneurial experience 15:10 – A day in the life of a mentor 17:40 – Tips for being a better mentor Links and Resources: Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E142 · Wed, February 05, 2025
Blogging Isn't Dead
Does blogging still matter in tech? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , host Kimberly Rhodes chats with 37signals' Principal Programmer Jorge Manrubia about why blogging is very much alive. They dig into the history of the 37signals developers blog, the company's process for contributions, and the added benefits this communication tool provides. Key Takeaways: 00:50 – Meet Jorge 01:03 – The history of the 37signals developers blog 02:25 – The process — who contributes and how topics are decided 05:09 – Benefits of writing on the blog and sharing content with the public 07:40 – What to consider when starting a company blog 09:43 – Sharing code isn’t as revealing as you might think 11:28 – Secondary benefits of sharing your content 13:30 – What’s next for the blog? Links and Resources: The 37signals Dev Blog Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E141 · Wed, January 29, 2025
Building a Community
There is a way to bring your customers together in a meaningful way. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , host Kimberly Rhodes welcomes 37signals' Support Team members Merissa Dawson and Ashley Bowe to discuss how the Basecamp Community came to life. They describe how they've connected with Basecamp customers and how they've connected customers with each other. They also offer a few tips for anyone looking to start their own community of customers and company enthusiasts. Key Takeaways: 00:40 – Meet Merissa and Ashley from Basecamp Support 01:54 – The Basecamp Community origin story 05:03 – The Community as a place for sharing and collaboration 07:20 – The 37signals team role within the Community 09:08 – Starting a community without fear of failure 13:27 – Tips for starting your own community of users and fans Links and Resources: Join the Basecamp Community " Launch: 37signals Answers" from Signal v. Noise How Decent Espresso uses multiple tools in a single Basecamp project Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E140 · Wed, January 22, 2025
Support is a Feature
Customer support is more than just a department — it’s a core feature of any great product. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , Kimberly Rhodes chats with Chase Clemons, Head of Customer Support at 37signals, about the company's view of support as a product feature. They discuss 37signals' approach to helping customers, the value of ongoing training, and how AI can fit into support strategy without sacrificing the personal connection. Key Takeaways: 00:37 – Chase Clemons, Head of Support at 37signals 02:12 – Customer Support is a feature, not a cost center. 04:09 – Support should focus on the customer experience 06:36 – Using case studies to train your support team 07:49 – Team members are trusted to use good judgment 09:58 – Maintaining a friendly, conversational tone with customers 11:27 – Measuring success in Customer Support 14:12 – AI vs. the human element in Support 17:25 – Encourage customers to reach out Links and Resources: Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E139 · Wed, January 15, 2025
Hire When It Hurts
Wondering when it’s the right time to grow your team? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals' co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson chat about their “hire when it hurts” approach as described in their book REWORK . They cover why you shouldn’t rush into bringing someone on board, how to know when there's a critical business need, and how to seize the moment when the right people show up. Key Takeaways: 00:38 – Try tackling projects with the team you already have before hiring 02:43 – Some roles don’t call for a full-time position 07:33 – Knowing the difference between an actual staffing shortage vs. just being busy 09:48 – A workload spike doesn’t always mean it’s time to expand 12:33 – Snagging available talent early if you’re already planning to hire soon 15:35 – One open position can become multiple hires when the talent pool is just right Links and Resources: Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E138 · Wed, January 08, 2025
Seven Shipping Principles
How does 37signals decide when software is ready to ship? In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss the company's Seven Shipping Principles . They dive into when a product update is good enough to ship and the importance of making updates to solve actual problems. Key Takeaways: 00:11 – We only ship good work. 03:36 – The problem with MVPs 04:41 – We ship when we're confident. 10:08 – We own the issues after we ship. 13:41 – We don’t ship if it isn’t right. 17:11 – Making sure your solution tackles a real problem 20:00 – We ship to our appetite. Links and Resources: “Seven Shipping Principles” from the 37signals website Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E137 · Tue, December 24, 2024
Building to Flip is Building to Flop (replay)
In this episode (originally aired February 1, 2022), 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with Shaun Hildner to discuss the consequences of building a business solely with the intention to sell. They share their perspective on building a business for the long haul versus for an exit. Key Takeaways: 00:46 – Building a company to sell can encourage mediocre output 07:14 – Taking shortcuts is a reflection of one's character 09:41 – Why it's better to have a commitment strategy than an exit strategy 11:21 – Not all businesses should become unicorns 14:58 – What the founders would do if they had to begin again Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E136 · Wed, December 18, 2024
The Biggest Customer Conundrum
Bigger isn't always better. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share the drawbacks of chasing high-profile, enterprise deals. The two founders explain why they prefer their business model that's built around serving smaller clients. Key Takeaways: 00:35 – The biggest clients can quickly become the biggest burden and the biggest risk 07:10 – The hidden costs of “whale-sized” clients 12:35 – Things to consider when defining your ideal client 17:02 – Knowing what types of clients you'll enjoy working with 19:53 – How venture capital funding can make a difference when choosing your ideal clients Links and Resources: "Don't have a biggest customer" from Jason Fried's HEY World "A Static Business is a Healthy Business" from Jason Fried's HEY World Books by 37signals 30-day free trial of HEY Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E135 · Wed, December 11, 2024
The End of Year Junk Drawer
As the year winds down, 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson join host Kimberly Rhodes to talk about the company's end-of-year routine. They explain their process for the last few weeks of the year that aren't part of a formal six-week cycle, and they share what they gain from this transitional period of "wandering." Key Takeaways: 00:43 – The informal end of year process 05:24 – Self-directed work, bug fixes, and tying up loose ends 08:22 – Using the downtime for forward thinking and planning 12:43 – Viewing the year end as a shift to the next chapter rather than a fresh start Links and Resources: 30-day free trial of HEY Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E134 · Wed, December 04, 2024
A Product Pivot
Before introducing a new product feature, it’s essential to first understand the problem you're trying to fix. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share a recent experience designing a new feature in HEY. During the process, the team pivoted and changed direction, resulting in a better design. Key Takeaways: 00:44 – The original product design plan and what changed along the way 02:31 – The difference between specifying the outcome and diagnosing the actual problem 06:27 – The design meeting where the team got to the root of the problem 08:32 – Why executive involvement early in the process adds value 13:39 – Pivoting on an original idea while maintaining the original appetite 16:04 – Creativity often comes when you've hit a roadblock 20:07 – The power of Power Through New Links and Resources: 30-day free trial of HEY Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E133 · Wed, November 27, 2024
Your Competition is Your Costs
Remaining profitable in business is a simple equation — sales revenue exceeding operating costs. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast , 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson explain why controlling costs should be a bigger focus than what your competition is doing. They share some simple strategies for analyzing costs and share why operating without a formal office space might be worth considering. Key Takeaways: 00:37 – Why you should stop worrying about what everyone else is doing 02:26 – Focusing on the things within your control 06:58 – Analyzing your business' cash cows, dogs, and shooting stars 11:21 – Budgeting doesn’t always mean being frugal 12:24 – Weighing cost against value 16:16 – What the company gained by letting go of a physical office space 18:31 – Aesthetics of a well-run, profitable business 21:06 – The biggest expenses entrepreneurs often overlook Links and Resources: "You only compete with one thing" from Jason Fried's HEY World "Our cloud-exit savings will now top ten million over five years" from David Heinemeier Hansson's HEY World 37signals' meet-up expenses Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E132 · Wed, November 20, 2024
AI, Employee Equity, and Other Listener Questions
Every week, we invite listeners to send in their questions for 37signals’ co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson. In this episode, they tackle a fresh set of asks, covering topics from managing multiple product lines, the company’s bonus structure, and their thoughts on incorporating AI into their tools. Key Takeaways: 00:37 – How 37signals' looks at AI and using AI while exiting the cloud 03:47 – How to prioritize work when managing multiple product lines 11:33 – Deciding what problems to tackle first 18:49 – The company's take on equity and the structure of their profit-sharing plan Links and Resources: 37signals' Employee Handbook Basecamp classes with live Q&A Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E131 · Wed, November 13, 2024
What are You Replacing?
When it comes to business, it’s important to consider not only what customers would gain by using your product or service, but also what they're giving up. In this episode of The REWORK Podcast, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, chat about understanding your customer's needs and motivations. They highlight that your competition isn't always who you think it is, and they discuss ways to position your product to address the customer's actual challenges. Key Takeaways: 00:40 - The habit of the present. What people are already doing? 02:19 - A customer's alternative isn't always your direct competitor 05:06 - 37signals competition now vs. when the company started 06:29 - Being open to something new often requires breaking a habit 12:13 - Considering what people are replacing when developing 37signals newest products 14:00 - How dogfooding your product helps you figure out what it needs 17:33 - Using free trials, 1:1 demos, and group classes to give potential customers experience with your product Links and Resources: Jason's post about what your product replaces on X Basecamp classes with live Q&A Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E130 · Wed, November 06, 2024
Question Your Customers
Ever filled out a customer survey? For this conversation, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, share their approach to gathering customer feedback. They discuss the timing and frequency of feedback requests, the power of open-ended questions, and how to transform customer language into effective marketing. Key Takeaways: 00:37 - A single open-ended question can reveal a wealth of valuable insights 05:51 - Listen for the language customers use in their feedback for possible marketing opportunities 08:42 - Form questions and answer fields that allow customers to use their own words to express what they think 14:18 - Focus on organic feedback rather than quantitative metrics Links and Resources: Customer feedback on basecamp.com Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E129 · Wed, October 30, 2024
V1 is for Us
In this week's episode of The REWORK Podcast, 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share their approach to product design, explaining why the first version of a product (V1) is always built for the company's internal use case. They discuss responding to user feedback and the importance of actively using their own products to uncover issues. They also dive into the challenges they've faced when building software for someone else's needs vs. their own. Key Takeaways: 00:35 - The problem with imagined use cases 07:21 - A trimmed down V1 gives you permission to focus on what's most important 10:28 - The story of Highrise 17:27 - “Dogfooding” to help identify and address product issues 20:48 - Avoid the temptation to react too quickly to early customer feedback 23:11 - Design breakthroughs come to life by creating innovative solutions Links and Resources: Version 1 is for you – Jason Fried's HEY World post Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com \ HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTub e The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTub e @37signals on X
S2 E128 · Wed, October 23, 2024
Principles of Communication
37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share insights from their write-up, The 37signals Guide to Internal Communication . They discuss effective communication strategies within the company and with the public, offering practical advice to consider when conveying messages. Key Takeaways: 00:41 - The backstory of how the guide was created 02:39 - The write up serves as both an internal reminder and a practical manual for how communication is handled at 37signals 06:36 - Why publishing doesn’t require perfection 10:52 - Poor communication can lead to misunderstandings 18:26 - How unclear communication can come across negatively 23:03 - Why you shouldn't rush tough conversations Links and Resources: The 37signals Guide to Internal Communication Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E127 · Wed, October 16, 2024
Say No by Default
In their book REWORK, 37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson write about the power of saying no. This week on the podcast, they revisit that idea, diving into the hidden costs of saying yes and the burden of commitments that often come with it. They also discuss how saying no preserves simplicity and helps maintain focus. Key Takeaways: 00:45 – Saying yes often comes with regret 03:00 – Yes feels good until it’s time to fulfill the commitment 07:58 – Adding features to products often results in layered complications 14:53 – Saying no is more difficult when you have the capacity to say yes 19:51 – The courage to say no creates space for simplicity 29:30 – The best way to say to no to customer requests Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E126 · Wed, October 09, 2024
Preparing for a Company Meet-up
Twice a year, 37signals brings the entire team together for a company meet-up. In this week’s episode of The REWORK Podcast , co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson reflect on how these meet-ups began and how they've evolved over time. They also discuss how they prepare for the meet-ups and the importance of the venue selection. Key Takeaways: 00:50 - Jason shares the early history of 37signals' meet-ups 02:18 - Why in-person conferences build deeper connections than online meetings 06:57 - How the location and architecture of meeting spaces can elevate the experience 15:30 - Weighing the financial cost of a meet-up against the value it delivers 18:48 - Memories from the company's Atlanta gathering 22:17 - An inside look at the meet-up agenda Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E125 · Wed, October 02, 2024
Achieving Optionality
37signals’ co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson explore the many benefits of having full control over their business. They talk about the importance of taking measured profits and running an efficient operation, which allows freedom to create without constraints. This approach gives them room for trial and error and plenty of flexibility for expanded opportunities. Key Takeaways: 00:41 - The launch of Writebook confirmed 37signals' achievement of optionality 03:19 - Ideas and decisions don’t have to be perfect when a company is run efficiently 09:26 - 37signals history with buyout offers 11:22 - When it was tempting to consider venture capital offers 18:03 - Finding fulfillment in doing what you love rather than creating solely for profit Links and Resources: “Achieving Optionality” HEY World post by Jason Fried Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E124 · Wed, September 25, 2024
Progressing in Public Speaking
It's been reported that up to 75% of the population has a fear of public speaking . This week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, recount some of their previous speaking engagements and share a few tips for building the skill. They discuss the styles of successful speakers and their thoughts on being over prepared. Key Takeaways: 00:47 - Jason recalls his first speaking gig 02:30 - David shares his preferred style of delivering a talk 06:48 - Preparing for talks, podcasts, and Q&A sessions 08:15 - Preparing for keynote speeches and speaking with authenticity 13:05 - Examples of great public speakers who are authentically themselves on stage 14:43 - Being comfortable improvising a bit on stage Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E123 · Wed, September 18, 2024
Everybody Works
37signals' co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss their unique approach of operating without full-time managers. They reflect on the company's experience with full-time managers and share why they've moved to a flatter organization. Key Takeaways: 00:54 - The before and after of 37signals' experience with full-time managers 08:34 - The founders thoughts on being directly involved in the business 10:36 - Why the company's management hierarchy works best for the founders 17:17 - 37signals' career ladder doesn't necessarily mean people leadership 20:03 - What company size makes sense for having more management layers Links and Resources: HEY World post – We once more have no full-time managers at 37signals Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E122 · Wed, September 11, 2024
Dare to Be Basic
This week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, examine why it's advantageous to keep things simple — in both products and business. They challenge the idea that complex or bespoke tools are the best way to go and lean into not overcomplicating things. Key Takeaways: 00:34 - The power of keeping things simple 10:55 - Why small businesses don't need to act like big businesses 12:04 - The beauty of embracing what you don’t know when starting something new 18:01 - Building products with depth versus surface area 23:09 - Knowing when to listen to customers for product input and ideas Links and Resources: Merchants of Complexity Post by David Heinemeier Hansson Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E121 · Wed, September 04, 2024
How We Work: Kickoffs & Heartbeats
37signals works in 6-week cycles, which begin with a Kickoff and wrap up with a Heartbeat. In this week’s REWORK podcast, co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson break down the purpose and benefits of the Kickoff and Heartbeat documents and share tips for implementing this process across an organization. Key Takeaways 00:40 - When 37signals started using Kickoffs and Heartbeats 02:13 - Details of the Kickoff write-up process 07:34 - How much input Jason and David have in the Kickoff 13:43 - What Kickoffs & Heartbeats look like for departments with ongoing work 17:37 - The Heartbeats as an opportunity to highlight and celebrate the work of individual employees and team 22:50 - The benefits of writing up work summaries for institutional history Links and Resources Shape Up Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E120 · Wed, August 28, 2024
Maintaining a business partnership, simple product design, and other listener questions
This week on the REWORK podcast, 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson answer another round listener questions. Jason and David talk about the ups and downs of their long-running business partnership and friendship, tackle a critical question about Basecamp, and share their thoughts on starting a new company. Plus, they reveal the inspiration behind their Campfire software. Key Takeaways 00:34 – How Jason and David's partnership has stood the test of time 09:21 – A listener's opinion on Basecamp's shortcomings 14:56 – Advice for building a new company from the ground up. 25:35 – Creating products out of a need versus seeing a business opportunity Links and Resources Is group chat making you sweat? Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E119 · Wed, August 21, 2024
Using AI for Writing, Being Facebook Free, and other Listener Questions
In this episode, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, return from a summer hiatus to answer a new set of listener questions. They dive into topics like the role of A.I. in writing and their updated thoughts on staying Facebook-free. REWORK host, Kimberly Rhodes also gets in a question of her own. Key Takeaways 00:38 - Emphasizing the importance of using your own voice in writing rather than relying on AI 05:50 - Discussing how targeted advertising can be beneficial for some but not for everyone 08:50 - One disagreement with a company or person shouldn't lead to complete condemnation 19:28 - David shares his reflections on taking a summer break from X (formerly Twitter) Links & Resources Google pulls Dear Sydney ad Google - Dear Sydney Ad ONCE.com Jobs at 37signals Books by 37signals HEY World The REWORK Podcast The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube 37signals on X
S2 E118 · Wed, July 17, 2024
Scratch Your Own Itch (Replay)
In their book REWORK, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson write about the benefits of building products and services that you use yourself. "The easiest, most straightforward way to create a great product or service is to make something you want to use." In this episode, originally aired November 2, 2021, Jason and David sit down with Shaun Hildner to discuss creating products that scratch your own itch. Key Takeaways 00:43 – The origins of Basecamp and how it fulfilled an internal need 04:38 – Building to solve your own problems vs. someone else's 06:27 – The evolution of HEY and how it was created to solve their own frustrations with email 09:50 – How building for yourself leads to better quality control 14:25 – The problem with creating MVPs (Minimum Viable Products) and building based on customer feedback alone Links and Resources Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY Once | Campfire The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E117 · Wed, July 10, 2024
Listener Questions: Ops Edition
In this episode of the Rework podcast, host Kimberly Rhodes chats with Eron Nicholson from 37signals' operations team. He shares insight on his role and the department's various functions. The conversation covers details on the ops team structure, system reliability, global expansion projects and more. Key Takeaways 00:38 - Meet Eron 02:17 - The structure of the “ops” team 05:15 - On-call coverage and schedule 08:40 - Managing data center outages 13:25 - Balancing project cycles with system administration 16:56 - A sneak peek into the Amsterdam project Links & Resources 37signals developers blog Optimizing Site Performance via Anycast Routing Jobs at 37signals ONCE.com Books by 37signals HEY World The REWORK Podcast The REWORK Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube 37signals on X Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com
S2 E116 · Wed, July 03, 2024
Listener Questions - HR Edition
In this episode, Andrea LaRowe, Head of People Operations at 37signals, joins host Kimberly Rhodes to answer questions about the company's HR practices. They discuss the company's management structure and performance evaluations and what the company looks for when hiring. Andrea also shares what's involved in the All Hands meeting and tips for planning a company meet-up. Key Takeaways: 00:42 - Meet Andrea 02:19 - 37signals' managerial structure and one-on-one process 06:15 - 360 evaluations and annual employee reviews 09:38 - What job applicants can do to stand out 12:45 - All-hands meetings 17:21 - Company meetups 21:57 - Hiring employees using the ‘manager of one’ concept Links and Resources: Jobs at 37signals Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com Once software products HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E115 · Wed, June 26, 2024
The Aim for a Name
In this podcast episode, Kimberly Rhodes talks with Jason Fried, CEO and co-founder of 37signals, about the process of naming products. He discusses practical considerations like domain availability, trademarks, and logo design. Key Takeaways: 00:28 - The process of naming a product 03:05 - Researching domain names and trademarks 07:14 - The style of a product name 10:04 - The journey from the working title to the official title 13:11 - Designing and updating branding logos 20:48 - Gathering input on the name Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY Once | Campfire The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E114 · Wed, June 19, 2024
ONCE (again)
In this episode, Kimberly Rhodes hosts a discussion with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, about their newest product. And the best news? It will be free and simple to use. Key Takeaways: 00:26 - The next Once product 02:52 - The excitement of easily sharing free information in book form online 07:02 - Simplified publishing software that you completely control 12:12 - Starting a new product from scratch creates an open space for new ideas 15:55 - The various authors and enthusiasts that may want to use the new product 22:10 - Making the case on why this product is free 25:27 - Q&A from X (Twitter) Links and Resources: ONCE.com Jason Fried on Twitter / X and LinkedIn David Heinemeier Hansson on Twitter / X and LinkedIn The 37signals Employee Handbook Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E113 · Wed, June 12, 2024
Founder-led Marketing
REWORK's host Kimberly Rhodes discusses the unique marketing approach of 37signals with its co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson. They talk about how their process is simply sharing their perspectives and products, instead of traditional advertising. They champion genuine interaction over transactional posts and content. Key Takeaways: 00:37 - What Founder-Led Marketing means for 37signals 02:43 - The journey to finding the authentic voice of the brand 09:24 - Why paid advertising doesn’t always work as intended 16:50 - The love/hate relationship of posting content 27:19 - There are different decorums for different platforms Links and Resources: Saddleback Leather Company Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E112 · Wed, June 05, 2024
For the Love of Linux
In this podcast episode, REWORK host Kimberly Rhodes talks with David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founder of 37signals and CTO, about his personal shift from using Apple products to exploring Linux and Windows platforms. He discusses the expanded platform integration at 37signals, which now includes all three operating systems. Key Takeaways: 00:21 - The last straw with Apple 06:34 - Discovering Microsoft’s recent improvements and support of developers 10:30 - Linux and Windows work well together 13:27 - The user-friendly and upgradeable Framework laptop 17:45 - Transitioning 37signals to a multi-platform development team 22:58 - David’s recommended computing and operating systems Links and Resources: Steve Ballmer: Developers! The Ikea Effect Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E111 · Wed, May 29, 2024
The Subtle Art of Staying Out of It
In this episode, REWORK host Kimberly Rhodes, talks with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, about the importance of stepping out of the day-to-day operations as a founder. Giving employees room to call the shots can spark new ideas and get things done faster. It also inspires people to think beyond just following orders. Key Takeaways: 00:34 - The result of holding your grip too tight in your organization 02:36 - Find the middle ground between projects you should be directly involved in and those that can be managed by others 08:38 - Giving employees the freedom to make decisions can lead to increased productivity and better ideas 10:20 - Stepping in when it's necessary to realign urgency or quality 12:54 - Not all opinions weigh the same 15:28 - Trying to be involved in every task or decision reduces the organization's effectiveness 22:48 - Intent prompts people to think independently instead of just following a set of instructions, as described in the book Turn the Ship Around. Links and Resources: Staying Out of It Blog Post by Jason Fried Turn The Ship Around book Blue Ocean Strategy book Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E110 · Wed, May 22, 2024
Behind the Scenes of the REWORK podcast
Elaine Richards, 37signals' Chief Operating Officer, shakes things up by flipping the script on host, Kimberly Rhodes. They discuss the behind-the-scenes work of producing the REWORK podcast and selecting topics that resonate with the audience. They even dive into Kimberly's background in podcasting and how the podcast has changed over time. Key Takeaways: 01:41 - It all started for Kimberly with an event industry podcast 05:19 - The process of creating and reviewing the final product 10:41 - Expanding episodes from audio-only to adding video 12:00 - Creating the video set 14:01 - Broadening podcast content beyond the REWORK essays 19:15 - Not all episode ideas make it to air 20:58 - Evaluating the podcast stats 22:22 - The most popular REWORK Podcast themes and episodes Podcasting Tools we use: Podcast Recording – SquadCast Podcast Hosting – Buzzsprout Transcripts and Captions – Rev Social Clips – Opus Clip Episode Mentions: David Heinemeier Hansson’s HEY World blog Jason Fried’s HEY World blog This Week In Weddings Podcast Summer Fridays Leaving The Cloud How We Work: Fewer Meetings, More Check-Ins Software Has Bugs Ask the Founders: Live Q&A with Jason Fried & David Heinemeier Hansson A Matter of Ambition - Part 2 Additional Links & Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E109 · Wed, May 15, 2024
A Matter of Ambition - part 2
In this episode of Rework, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, continue their discussion on ambition, focusing on generating ideas and the process of deciding which projects to pursue. They talk about the importance of experimentation, and how they decide which products to maintain or discontinue. Key Takeaways: 00:38 - Experimenting and seeing what works in the market 03:07 - The more you build, the more ideas you generate 09:00 - Determining when a product is commercially viable 13:18 - The downfalls of overanalyzing a product before it’s built 17:31 - Balancing ambition with realistic timelines Links and Resources: https://killedbygoogle.com/ Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E108 · Wed, May 08, 2024
A Matter of Ambition
In this episode of Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes alongside 37signals co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, talk about the company's renewed sense of ambition and excitement for upcoming projects. They highlight the importance of keeping things fresh, while emphasizing the balance between ambition and practicality. Key Takeaways: 00:41 - The source of the company’s ambition explained 02:18 - Sticking to fundamentals and simplicity can still have a major impact 06:09 - A hefty price tag on software doesn’t mean it’s good 11:29 - How 37signals structures teams for new product development 18:17 - Uncertainty can serve as adventure the exact path to success is not known 22:32 - A change in priorities is often necessary to fuel ambition 24:59 - The motivation is to make products better Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E107 · Wed, May 01, 2024
How We Work: Summer Fridays
In this episode, host Kimberly Rhodes chats with 37signals' cofounders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson about the company's Summer Fridays policy, which grants employees a four-day workweek from May to September. While the perk encourages work-life balance and a feeling of seasonality, there are drawbacks to consider, like reduced productivity. Key Takeaways: 00:46 - 37signals' Summer Friday policy and why it was initially introduced 03:09 - The trade-offs the company makes with summer hours 10:12 - The challenge with summer hours in the pursuit of more ambitious goals 13:09 - How the company balances coverage for always-on teams, like customer support 16:17 - The effect on team projects that require collaboration Links and Resources: Samsung shifts to emergency mode with 6-day work week for executives The Hawthorne Effect Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E106 · Wed, April 24, 2024
A Spin-off Story
In the podcast, REWORK host Kimberly Rhodes talks with 37signals co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, about their journey spinning off products. They stress the value of keeping contracts simple and how once the handover is done, it's best to take a hands-off approach and let the new team run things. They share their experiences with boards and underline the need for trust and flexibility. Key Takeaways: 00:43 - The steps they took to transition "Know Your Company" into its own independent entity. 04:49 - Contracts don't offer as much protection as people believe. 10:58 - The differences in spinning off a startup vs. a long-established company. 14:53 - Letting capable partners take the reins and run the show independently. 18:51 - The challenge in finding the right partner for a spin-off business. 20:12 - In any transaction, things may not turn out as expected, but it may be worth taking calculated risks. 23:19 - Contracts don't necessarily prevent disputes and can sometimes escalate them unnecessarily. Links and Resources: Canopy , formerly known as Know Your Company ‘Know Your Company’ Deal Structure Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E105 · Wed, April 17, 2024
Disagree and Commit
"Consensus is cozy, but broad agreement is not our aim. The right decision is. Which is why we take the time to think, debate, persuade, listen and reconsider and then, someone, decides. If you disagree, that’s fine, but once the decision is made, it’s time to commit and support it completely." Tune in as Kimberly leads a chat with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, about the concept of Disagree and Commit. Once a decision is made, everyone should be in 100% — no looking back. Key Takeaways: 01:01 - Breaking down how Disagree and Commit operates 02:17 - Identifying the most suitable person to make the final decision based on the circumstance 07:40 - Embracing the "manager of one" concept, empowering individuals to decide independently with reasonable supervision 09:33 - Acknowledging that delegating decisions doesn't compromise the emphasis on quality 14:04 - Always keeping the door open to revisit and tweak things 15:44 - Granting capable individuals the freedom to make mistakes, alongside providing guidance for improvement 20:35 - Viewing hiring not just as an evaluation of current abilities but also considering potential growth opportunities. Links and Resources: Jeff Bezos 2016 Letter to Amazon Shareholders There’s No Speed Limit by Derek Sivers – https://sive.rs/kimo Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube
S2 E104 · Wed, April 10, 2024
Strangers at a Cocktail Party
Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, dive into their book REWORK and discuss the essay “Strangers at a Cocktail Party” with Rework host, Kimberly Rhodes. From their experience, hiring too many people at once can throw off the balance and continuity of a company's culture. They talk about the importance of gradual assimilation and how culture is implicit, not always written down. They share insights on the value of fresh perspectives and the excitement of facing challenges head-on. Key Takeaways: 00:30 - Gradually integrating new hires is important for upholding an organization's established norms and values. 02:30 - Company culture is nurtured through the daily interactions and collective experiences shared within an organization. 05:34 - New hires inject new perspectives and innovative ideas into the mix. 07:14 - Embracing crises and novel challenges is part of the excitement of running a business. 12:19 - Reflecting on the hiring patterns at 37signals. 14:23 - While change is essential for adjusting the company's culture and strategy, it's vital to implement it carefully and minimize disruptions. Links and Resources: The Half-Life of Facts by Samuel Arbesman All About Atlas - Boston Dynamics Robot Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E103 · Wed, April 03, 2024
The Wrong Time for Real Time
This episode of REWORK delves into an essay from the book "It Doesn't Have To Be Crazy At Work," co-authored by Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, advocating for the use of asynchronous communication for work projects. During the discussion, they explore the downside of chat and suggest it be reserved for informal discussions and social interactions. Key Takeaways: 00:36 - Different communication methods in the workplace – chat vs. asynchronous 02:22 - The benefits of centralized communication for project management and how chat can hinder productivity 09:20 - Managing multiple conversations for a single project 11:28 - How project management tools reduce the need for frequent meetings, check-ins, and follow-ups 20:05 - Data retention practices for both formal and informal communication Links and Resources: Once. com – https://once.com/ Campfire – https://once.com/campfire Books by 37signals – https://37signals.com/books Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY – https://www.hey.com/ The REWORK podcast – https://37signals.com/podcast/ Rework is a production of 37signals. You can find show notes and transcripts on our website. Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X. If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email, and we might answer it on a future episode.
S2 E102 · Wed, March 27, 2024
More Than a Month of Once
In this episode of REWORK, host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with the co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, to provide an update on their latest product — Campfire, under the Once umbrella — just about one month after its initial launch. Once introduces a new software paradigm where users pay just once and own it forever, departing from the conventional subscription model. The discussion delves into their pricing strategy, their emphasis on long-term profitability over immediate gains, and offers insights into what lies ahead for Once. Key Takeaways: 00:32 - Initial Reflections: Once, 30 Days In 02:03 - Setting Benchmarks: Unveiling Novel Concepts for Long-Term Success 09:58 - Embracing the Journey: Finding Joy in the Process 13:39 - Looking Forward: The Future Trajectory of Once 15:53 - Taking Risks: Navigating the Gambles of Product Launches 23:24 - Pricing Puzzles: Deciphering the Right Value Links and Resources: Once. com and Campfire Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY.com The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E101 · Wed, March 20, 2024
How We Work: Finding the Right Team
37signals is hiring! However, the traditional resume and formal education credentials don’t rank as high as you might think in their hiring process. In this episode of The Rework Podcast, host Kimberly Rhodes chats with co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson about reviewing potential job candidates. You’ll hear them discuss why a personalized cover letter can tell a lot more about a potential hire than chronological work history, and why AI isn’t always a dependable author for those details. Key Takeaways: 00:45 - Resumes are basically piles of lies 02:27 - Cover letters should explain why you want the job 05:07 - Test driving final candidates 11:05 - Jason and David’s involvement in the hiring process 18:59 - Finding employees that are the right cultural fit Rework is a production of 37signals. You can find show notes and transcripts on our website. Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X. If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email rework@37signals.com, and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E100 · Wed, March 13, 2024
A New Take on Platform Preferences
David Heinemeier Hansson recently revealed that he's making the switch from Apple to Android and trading in his Mac for a PC. In this week's episode, cofounders of 37signals Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss the shift in direction, the events that led to the change of platform, and what the company was missing by being focused on the Apple ecosystem. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: From the Apple Newsroom: The App Store, Spotify, and Europe's Thriving Digital Music Market Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X
S2 E99 · Wed, March 06, 2024
Rapid Fire with Jason & David
Kimberly is switching things up this week and taking a more casual approach with the co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, asking them a series of rapid fire questions. Jason, for example, reveals the book that granted them permission to forge their unique path, while David shares the profound advice from Jeff Bezos about investing in things that don't change. The two of them also open up about their business journey, the meaning behind their work, and even hint toward upcoming projects. Get ready for a candid and insightful peek into the minds of Jason and David. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: [0:27] - How Ricardo Semler's Maverick empowered Jason [0:53] - David also credits Blue Ocean Strategy [1:25] - Best piece of advice? [4:39] - Productive habits? [6:20] - Most meaningful part of David’s and Jason’s jobs? [9:32] - Discussing inspirations like nature and architecture [11:02] - First principles, tech exploration, and aesthetics inspire David. [13:16] - David is embarking on a grand adventure fueled by unresolved anger. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: <a href='https://www.amazon.com/Maverick-Success-Behind-Unusual-Workplace/dp/0446670553/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2FR6G0E4E9C80&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Zq9MA6vXomuOILGSPCOOZhtsRzTfQZWX_gCBMkA8DU_7fI1Xe9gWW8qs-2eN5VkzpgPMkC3WuVZ7Q8SxJsmjcIjtvs6_DqMVi0jU
S2 E98 · Wed, February 28, 2024
Press Releases Are Spam
Kimberly sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to discuss a chapter from REWORK titled “Press Releases Are Spam,” explaining why traditional press releases don't work well for their product launches. The conversation touches on the shift from formal press releases to direct-to-consumer approaches in today’s media scene. They touch upon the importance of hearing from authentic voices with skin in the game rather than relying on formulaic press releases. The founders also share insights on their personal involvement in marketing and the ups and downs of being engaged in the social media attention game. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: [0:40] - Press releases haven’t worked for 37signals [6:59] - Awkward CEO making direct-to-consumer work sets a significant trend [9:05] - Press releases signal desperation; personal connections more effective [14:17] - Authenticity trumps marketing. [20:24] - Don't delegate your voice; maintain direct communication [25:52] - Balancing the trade-offs of social media [27:15] - Discussing navigating the intensity of attention culture Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X 37signals on LinkedIn
S2 E97 · Wed, February 21, 2024
Keep Calm and Delete the Tweet
Join host Kimberly in this episode for a candid chat with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson. Diving into a recent social media controversy, they discuss the decision-making process and lessons learned. The conversation covers the challenges of public communication, navigating social media, and the importance of thinking before reacting. Gain valuable insights into managing public image, handling controversies, and balancing authenticity with professionalism. The co-founders share personal experiences, encouraging a more thoughtful approach to online interactions and providing behind-the-scenes insights into successful business communication practices. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: [0:25] - Discussing recent social media controversy [5:47] - Importance of debating ideas rather than attacking individuals [7:47] - The complexity of media representation [9:22] - Patience and perspective in online discourse [15:21] - Occasional regrets are part of pushing boundaries. [19:44] - The complexity of tradeoffs Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X 37signals on LinkedIn
S2 E96 · Wed, February 14, 2024
The Myth of the Overnight Sensation
This week, join your host Kimberly Rhodes along with the co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, as they celebrate Basecamp's 20th and 37signals' upcoming 25th anniversaries. The excitement extends to the success of their book REWORK , which recently surpassed a million copies sold worldwide. They delve especially into the chapter titled "The Myth of the Overnight Sensation," exploring the book's journey, impact, and the challenges faced during its creation. From unexpected compromises with publishers to the book's timeless nature, Jason and David share insights on treating a book as a product and how it has aged well, continuing to resonate with readers around the globe. Jason and David also reflect on the writing process and the book's unique qualities, including its concise nature and impactful content. Tune in for a fascinating exploration of the past, present, and potential future of 37signals’ writing about work and business. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: [00:39] - Big news: REWORK just surpassed a million worldwide copies sold! [02:13] - The book was definitely not an overnight success. [04:12] - How treating books as products enhances impact, and longevity. [05:29] - The book, initially 50,000 words, was cut in half to 25,000, which caused a conflict. [07:06] - Hear about the compromise that was made. [10:25] - The book's brevity, initially concerning, impressed the editor, leading to improvements. [13:58] - How the book serves as a persuasive tool, empowering readers to articulate their thoughts. [15:52] - David points out that the book's immediate start contributed to its success. [18:24] - Writing a book is overrated; instead focus on consistent online writing. [20:06] - REWORK ’s success lies in compiling proven internet hits for lasting impact. [24:39] - Any plans for another book? Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY <a href='https://w
S2 E95 · Wed, February 07, 2024
It's All a Judgment Call
Chances are, you've heard Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson stress the vital role of trusting your instincts in business. This week, host Kimberly Rhodes takes a deeper dive into the heart of human decision-making with the co-founders of 37signals—exploring how the interplay of intuition and accumulated experiences becomes your compass for navigating the complex landscape of business decisions. Join Jason and David as they unravel the intricate dance between data-driven decisions and the art of making judgment calls, guiding listeners through trusting your gut and breaking free from external pressures when making product and pricing decisions. Listen in to discover how the power of experimentation and the 'try it and see' approach often unveil valuable insights, with reality as the ultimate judge. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: [00:28] - The limitations of data-driven decisions [03:00] - The magic of intuition and the black-box nature of gut decisions [04:53] - The role of market feedback in evaluating the effectiveness of decisions [06:39] - Cutting through the noise in decision making [09:00] - Experience and judgment in decision making [11:39] - Testing pricing and the importance of experimentation [15:45] - The crucial role of gut feelings [17:51] - Accepting uncertainty and avoiding perfectionism [21:10] - Utilizing momentum and adopting a 'try it and see' approach Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: From Jason's HEY World: It’s all a judgment call Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X <a href='https://www.linkedin.com/company/37si
S2 E94 · Wed, January 31, 2024
Readying for Launch
Product launches can be a delicate dance between anticipation and anxiety. Today on " Rework ", Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to explore the intricacies of knowing when a product is ready for launch. Listen in to learn the art of patience with the "Give It Five Minutes" principle and the necessity of building a "bucket of arrogance" to weather feedback storms during challenging launch phases. Don’t miss out on Jason and David's unparalleled insights as they delve into nuances involved in bringing a new product to the market. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Launching with impact—assessing quality, avoiding embarrassment, and infusing novelty are key elements in launching a memorable product to the market. By embracing a "swarm" approach, the team addresses and rectifies issues promptly during the initial launch ensuring a smoother user experience. "You can't design on people's requests. You have to design on their behalf"—how using a selective approach to customer feedback allows for more thoughtful and user-centric product development. Rejecting the concept of roadmaps, in favor of flexible product evolution. "Give it Five Minutes": why acknowledging the temporal unreliability of early feedback, especially during a launch, is crucial. How building a “bucket of arrogance” helps with weathering feedback storms. How prioritizing qualitative feedback over quantitative metrics during a product launch helps to address issues without compromising the product's integrity. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Give it Five Minutes From Jason's HEY World: Live with it for a while Software Has Bugs | REWORK This again, Apple? | REWORK Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HE
S2 E93 · Wed, January 24, 2024
REWORK Live!
In this special YouTube live episode, co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, join host Kimberly Rhodes to field live questions from listeners. Listen in as Jason and David answer questions about topics such as the recent launch of the HEY Calendar . They also share updates on the release of Campfire , the first ONCE product, with behind-the-scenes details about this simplified and affordable chat tool. Plus, tune in for insights into the evolution of the Shape Up methodology, learning from customer feedback post-launch, and the Founders' thoughts on the exciting but uncertain future of AI in the ever-evolving landscape of technology. Check out the LIVE video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Highlights from the HEY Calendar launch. Updates on the ONCE line of products from 37signals and the economics and philosophy behind fixed-price software products. Campfire's role as a simplified, affordable, and privacy-focused group chat tool. The importance of engaging with customer feedback after product launches. An overview of the evolution of the Shape Up methodology, its application in new product development, and adaptations for different team sizes. AI—excitement, caution, and its potential impact on the technology landscape. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, simply email us, leave a voicemail, or text us at 708-628-7850. Your question might just get featured in a future episode! Links and Resources: This Again, Apple? – REWORK podcast From David's HEY World: We’ve resubmitted the HEY Calendar app to Apple HEY Calendar ONCE 37signals Introduces Once | REWORK A Casual Walkthrough Tour of Campfir
S2 E92 · Wed, January 17, 2024
User Testing, Stoic Philosophy, and Other Listener Questions
In this episode of Rework, the spotlight is on listener questions. Listen in as Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson share their insights on a range of topics — from 37signals' approach to user testing and the impact of Stoic philosophy on their business principles, to discussions on profits and expenses, and the crucial decision of when to hire. Tune in to hear their unique perspectives on these key aspects of building a successful company. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Uncover why 37signals rejects traditional user testing and prioritizes being their own first customer. They unveil their unique perspective on product development and share the one question you need to test every product against. Explore how Stoicism functions as a mental operating system, fostering calm and efficient thinking in response to business challenges. David delves into Stoic principles and recommends some essential Stoic readings for entrepreneurs (See links below). Jason and David discuss their approach to profits, expenses, maintaining healthy margins, and the independence and freedom that profitability affords in decision-making. How to use the principle of "hire when it hurts" to ensure resources align with the business's growth and increased demand. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail, or send us a text at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it in a future episode. Links and Resources: The Manual by Epictetus On the Shortness of Life by Seneca A Guide to the Good Life: The Ancient Art of Stoic Joy by William B. Irvine Basecamp Automatic Check-ins Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube <a href='https://twitter.co
S2 E91 · Tue, January 09, 2024
This again, Apple?
Getting an app into Apple's app store without giving up 30% of profits is something the team at 37signals battled back in 2020 when it launched the HEY email service. What they didn't expect would be to have some of the same challenges in 2024 with the HEY Calendar app. Listen in as David Heinemeier Hansson shares the history of the 2020 challenge along with the most recent app store rejections — and the last minute update the team made to the app to get the final approval. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode.
S2 E90 · Wed, January 03, 2024
How We Work: Fewer Meetings, More Check-Ins
Today, we're diving into a question that has piqued the curiosity of many of our listeners and clients: How exactly does 37signals keep track of all the moving pieces in a fully remote company with team members spread throughout the world? The answer lies in our use of Automatic Check-ins , a tool embedded in Basecamp 3.0 that has revolutionized how we stay connected with what everyone is working on. But how do these Automatic Check-ins work, and why are they so essential to the pulse of our remote work culture? In this episode of Rework, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson join host Kimberly Rhodes to unveil the game-changing secrets behind 37signals' efficient work tracking system. Listen in as Jason and David explore the harmony between Automatic Check-ins and remote work, contrasting it with the cumbersome nature of traditional status meetings. Plus, discover the tool's impact on transparency, productivity, and the unique ways it fosters organic interactions within the team. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Uncover how Automatic Check-ins help liberate 37signals from the confines of traditional status meetings, providing a flexible and efficient way to share work updates. Explore the seamless compatibility between automatic check-ins and remote work, allowing individuals to respond on their terms. Delve into the unexpected motivation behind summarizing work, encouraging individuals to reflect meaningfully on their accomplishments. Learn how the Automatic Check-ins tool's ability to link to other projects enhances collaboration, offering a quick overview of individual contributions. Understand the practical leadership value of employing automatic check-ins, setting expectations for the team, and emphasizing the importance of regular communication. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Basecamp Automatic Check-ins Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com <a href='https://www.hey.com/wor
S2 E89 · Wed, December 27, 2023
Working with a Business Partner
In this week's episode of Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to share the essential elements that foster a thriving partnership. Witness firsthand the enduring stability of their collaboration as Jason and David explore how explicit power-sharing agreements and trust enable each partner to take the lead in their own domain. Tune in for a vibrant behind-the-scenes look at how mutual admiration and a shared commitment to vision and values has paved the way for Jason and David’s long standing partnership at 37signals. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Jason and David share their origin story—from “Apple” pay to the pivotal transition into a partnership after the Basecamp launch. Mutual admiration, respect, and the other factors that contribute to a successful partnership that allow Jason and David to make decisions based on their vision and values. The explicit power-sharing agreements that allow each partner to take the lead in their domain—Jason spearheading design and David steering programming. The value of embracing distinct dispositions in idea generation and differences in decision-making. The importance of engaging in productive—sometimes intense—discussions about product features and ideas. How the enduring longevity and stability of their partnership helps Jason and David to consistently reach mutually beneficial decisions. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X . If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on YouTube The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube @37signals on X 37signals on LinkedIn
S2 E88 · Wed, December 20, 2023
Look Back Less
"If you're going to look back at all, you should glance back but not stare." – Jason Fried In this episode of the Rework podcast, host, Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried, and David Heinemeier Hansson, to dive into a compelling question: How much attention should businesses really give to the past? Jason introduced this concept in his recent HEY World post called "Look Back Less," where he urged businesses to redirect their gaze toward the future, steering clear of excessive retrospective analysis. Join Jason and David as they explore the limitations of retrospection, highlighting the power of personal stakes, gut instincts, and a readiness to take risks, all under the sway of the market's response. Listen in as Jason and David navigate the intricacies of this business philosophy, touching on recent Twitter and YouTube comments that both echo and challenge their perspectives. Tune in to discover why continuous forward movement may hold the key to sustained success. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Judgment Calls vs. Data-Driven Decisions: challenge the conventional wisdom of relying solely on past analyses for predicting outcomes. Discover the power of founder-led decision-making, where personal stakes and a willingness to take risks fuel faster decisions and a culture of experimentation. Why the ability to admit mistakes is vital to maintaining agility and adaptability. Uncover the significance of gut instincts and unarticulated wisdom in decision-making. Explore the vital role of continuous forward movement in navigating the ever-evolving landscape of business. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: From Jason's HEY World: Look back less Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rewor
S2 E87 · Wed, December 13, 2023
Narrow As You Go
In their book, It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work , Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson stress the importance of narrowing the scope as a project unfolds, emphasizing, "After the initial dust settles, the work required to finish a project should be dwindling over time, not expanding." But navigating this challenge is not always easy. In this week's episode of Rework, Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason and David to explore the challenges and benefits of narrowing focus, particularly in the context of developing a new product. Jason and David delve into the significance of clear deadlines, effective strategies for managing a constant influx of ideas, and the importance of adhering to the principle of "done is better than perfect" so you can ship. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Why clear deadlines are crucial for honing, editing, and chiseling features to ensure a focused, timely delivery. How to avoid feature "pile-up" as a project progresses in order to prevent last-minute chaos and ensure a smoother path to completion. Start new product development with novel ideas to create a distinguishing factor for an audience seeking innovative solutions. Not every idea can be integrated without compromising a project's scope—be prepared to make decisions on what to include and what to postpone. Use the role of working memory to focus on what truly matters without being overwhelmed by an endless list of ideas. Resist the temptation to hoard ideas; instead, focus on a few key ideas that align with the project's goals. Done is better than perfect: small companies have the advantage of focusing on the perfect ratio between effort and value. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The Rework Podcast on
S2 E86 · Wed, December 06, 2023
Calendar Tetris
Ever find yourself trapped in a game of "Calendar Tetris," where each meeting block interrupts the natural flow of your day, leaving you little room for meaningful work? Today on Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to discuss the pitfalls of modern scheduling tools and their impact on productivity from their book, It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work . Listen in as they walk listeners through scheduling at 37signals, where they don't share calendars, and everyone is in control of their own time. Plus, tune in for a sneak peek of the upcoming HEY Calendar, with innovative features designed to empower you to regain control of your time. Key Takeaways: Learn the biggest problem with calendar Tetris and how these small, disjointed chunks hinder individual productivity and focus. Conversation over convenience - why actively asking for someone's time through conversation helps to foster intentionality (and reduces unnecessary meetings). Explore how 37signals redefines scheduling to empower individuals with full control over their time. Learn how the strategic introduction of scheduling friction prevents a culture of excessive meetings, fostering a shift toward asynchronous work. Discover a work culture where meetings are optional, highlighting the significance of prioritizing tasks with personal meaning. HEY is introducing a calendar! Just as the 37signals team revolutionized email, they've now transformed calendaring for 2024. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: From David's HEY World: Just let me do my job From Jason's LinkedIn: What my calendar looks like It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY <e
S2 E85 · Wed, November 29, 2023
The Outwork Myth
In today's hustle-centric work environment, there's a prevailing pressure to showcase constant busyness, sometimes at the expense of genuine productivity. However, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson present a refreshing perspective in their book "It Doesn't Have To Be Crazy Work," where the emphasis is on the quality of your time rather than the quantity. Join Jason and David as they sit down with Kimberly Rhodes to dismantle the myth of the "outwork" mentality and delve into the nuances of work ethic, productivity, and career advancement within the constantly changing dynamics of the workplace. Listen in as they discuss how to gauge authenticity and diligence during the recruitment process. Additionally, a listener question from Keith leads to insights on recognizing and rewarding high performers at 37signals. Tune in as they peel back the layers of productivity to construct a thriving work environment and a healthy work-life balance. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: What’s more important than the quantity of hours you work? The idea that working harder than everyone else guarantees success is debunked. Jason emphasizes the importance of not wasting time and avoiding unnecessary work that doesn't add value. David highlights that the focus should be on how time is spent and the quality of work produced. The pitfalls of busyness and trying to prove one’s worth can lead not only to inefficiency but also to being a nuisance to the team. The real threat of burnout and ways to maintain a healthy work-life balance. The pivotal role managers play in ensuring team members do not overwork and have the space to disconnect. The value of stretch goals—Jason and David discuss the importance of finding a middle ground between a steady state and occasionally pushing boundaries and finding a balance that fosters creativity, efficiency, and well-being. Why an internal locus of progress is crucial for thriving as a member of the 37signals team. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work <a href='https://37si
S2 E84 · Wed, November 22, 2023
What are you REALLY buying?
Every time you make a purchase, whether it's a tangible product or a service, you're casting a vote with your dollars for the type of company you want to support and the choices they make. So, what are you REALLY buying? Join host Kimberly Rhodes as she sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to explore the concept of "buying the company" as they dive into the diverse considerations that shape our purchasing choices. From supporting forward-thinking initiatives to valuing customer service and longevity, Jason and David illuminate what customers are truly investing in when opting for a smaller, bootstrap business like 37signals. Plus, a look at the ever-evolving nature of consumer preferences. Tune in for a thought-provoking exploration of the layers beneath purchasing decisions and valuable insights into crafting a brand that authentically mirrors your company's values. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: How you’re voting with your dollars when making purchasing decisions, and expressing support for a company's innovation, ease of use, company values, or a specific ethos. Companies that challenge the status quo and push boundaries can attract consumers who want to support forward-thinking and innovation. Consumers don't have to apply the same criteria to every purchase, allowing for flexibility in decision-making based on individual values and needs. A strong brand reputation can lead people to choose a product because they trust the company. Embracing the fluidity in consumer choices—people can change their minds based on evolving perspectives AND company actions. How you engage with your customers leaves a lasting impression and contributes to your company's reputation. Whether it's exceptional customer service, longevity, or a commitment to transparency, companies should actively promote the values that set them apart. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Rework book Books by 37signals 37signals Introduces ONCE | REWORK Introducing ONCE
S2 E83 · Wed, November 15, 2023
Underdo the Competition
In business, the idea that more is better often leads companies to engage in an endless race to add more features while losing sight of what truly matters to their users. Consider the iconic success of the iPod. By excelling at one thing, done exceptionally well, it attracted legions of unwaveringly loyal fans. This same philosophy is why the team at 37signals consistently aims for simplicity, recognizing it as the secret sauce for creating unforgettable products. In this episode, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the art of "underdoing" the competition as outlined in their book "Rework." From Basecamp's high-level simplicity to the disruptive potential of their new product line, "ONCE," the conversation explores the success of products that have rewritten the rules through simplicity, focusing on the small details that elevate products to greatness. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: Simplicity is the key to crafting unforgettable products. Why prioritizing value at the simpler end leads to success. Mere imitation without significant differences leads to failure—why challenging industry giants like Gmail requires radical differentiation AND originality. Small details = big impact. Learn from Tesla's success, where even seemingly insignificant details contribute to a unique user experience. Explore how 37signals is poised to offer radically simplified versions of existing products at better prices under the "ONCE" umbrella. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X (formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Rework book Books by 37signals 37signals Introduces ONCE | REWORK Introducing ONCE Blue Ocean Strategy: How to Create Uncontested Market Space and Make the Competition Irrelevant Sign up for a 30-day free trial a
S2 E82 · Wed, November 08, 2023
Speaking Gigs, Attending Conferences, and the Importance of Gathering
In a world dominated by virtual interactions, coming together in person offers an opportunity to foster deeper human connections that are impossible to achieve through any other means. Jason Fried recently took the stage in Vancouver and David Heinemeier Hansson did the same at Rails World in Amsterdam. Today, they join Kimberly Rhodes to share their unique perspectives on life beyond the digital realm. Listen in for their valuable tips for making the most of attending or speaking at conferences and embracing the personal growth that comes from stepping out of your comfort zone. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: The importance of real-life interactions to point out what's lacking in our digital-first world. The transformative power of in-person connection to reshape perceptions, and foster deeper human connections. The value of public speaking for the speaker: how speaking at conferences can help speakers distill their knowledge, engage with their audience, AND challenge themselves. Why emotion trumps content at conferences—what attendees are really seeking. Tips for navigating conferences, making meaningful connections, and pushing past your comfort zone for personal growth. Finding the right mix between expanding your social capacity, and knowing when to step back and recharge. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X [formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: Rails World 2023 Opening Keynote - David Heinemeier Hansson The Comfort Crisis: Embrace Discomfort To Reclaim Your Wild, Happy, Healthy Self Rework book Books by 37signals Sign up for a 30-day free trial at Basecamp.com HEY World | HEY The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog 37signals on YouTube The Re
S2 E81 · Wed, November 01, 2023
The F*#k No Feature
Have you ever wanted to bid farewell to bothersome emails without the hassle of unsubscribing or composing polite "please stop emailing me" requests? Today 37signals' co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, join host Kimberly Rhodes to walk listeners through HEY's newest addition that allows users to express their email frustrations unconventionally. Introducing the 'Fuck No' feature for those instances when a simple "no" just won't suffice. Listen in as Jason and David delve into the concept of Easter eggs—those hidden surprises that infuse a touch of edgy enjoyment into software. Then discover how this feature has emerged as a compelling reason for both newcomers and returning users to explore HEY as their email solution. If you've ever wanted a playful solution to solve an age-old email dilemma, tune in! Check out the full video episode on YouTube Key Takeaways: The 'Fuck No' feature in HEY : offering unapologetic email management with an edgy twist. In a world filled with seriousness, the 'Fuck No' feature serves as a reminder that software and work, in general, should be more lighthearted. The rapid implementation of the 'Fuck No' feature showcases the benefits of not overthinking things in order to allow your organization to implement small, low-risk changes quickly and efficiently. Resurrecting Easter eggs: rediscovering the hidden surprises in software that have all but disappeared in today’s tech world. Unprofessional? NOPE—how adding a playful edge can enhance the user experience and add a layer of levity that resonates with many (MOST) users. How the 'Fuck No' option is unleashing catharsis on annoying emails while enhancing the HEY user experience, and embodying 37signals dedication to empowering customers. Rework is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website . Full video episodes are available on YouTube and X [formerly known as Twitter). If you have a question for Jason or David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email , and we might answer it on a future episode. Links and Resources: A Cathartic New Feature in HEY—@jasonfried Rework book Books by 37signals <a href=
S2 E80 · Wed, October 25, 2023
Build an Audience
This episode kicks off with the Underdog Challenge winner sharing the unconventional strategies that enable his small business to take on their larger competitors. Then, 37signals' co-founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to delve into the power of building an audience through authentic content. Jason and David share the secret of building a genuine connection with your audience and the importance of having "skin in the game" in content creation. Listen in as they walk listeners through the vital components of organic content creation to engender trust and resonate with your audience in a landscape overflowing with "content marketing BS." Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] -Kimberly welcomes Christian Hyatt, the co-founder and CEO of cybersecurity company Risk3sixty , as the winner of 37signals' Underdog Challenge. [03:16] - Christian shares his top tip for underdogs. [03:50] - Kimberly awards one year of Basecamp Pro Unlimited to Christian and his team. [04:08] - 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson join the podcast to discuss building an audience through authentic content. [04:32] - Jason shares the key to building a genuine connection with your audience. [05:51] - David stresses the importance of demonstrating competence and having "skin in the game" in content creation. [09:34] - Why you should avoid adding more "content marketing bullshit" to the internet. [10:12] – Avoid the “content marketing playbook.” Today’s challenges in audience building require alternative marketing strategies. [10:55] - Kimberly discusses the concept of giving before asking inspired by Gary Vaynerchuk's book, Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook . [11:16] - Steering clear of rigid sharing schedules and examples of authentic, meaningful content that resonates with your audience. [12:04] - Keeping the easy from becoming hard . The importance of sharing thought processes and insights with your audience. [13:22] - A non-pushy approach to introducing new products or content. [15:54] - Advice for listeners on being willing to share and educate online, particularly in the face of potential internet criticism. [16:18] - The importance of an audience that includes supporters and detractors [18:50] - 37signals' marketing strategies, specifically their perspective on paid advertising and leveraging their existing audience. [19:07] - Building a trusted brand
S2 E79 · Wed, October 18, 2023
Inspiration is Perishable
"Ideas are immortal. They last forever. What doesn't last forever is inspiration. Inspiration is like fresh fruit or milk: it has an expiration date,” - from Rework , by Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson On this episode, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the Co-founders of 37signals, sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to share their perspective on the fleeting nature of inspiration with insights from the chapter called "Inspiration is Perishable" in their book, Rework . Listen in to discover why Jason and David liken inspiration to rocket fuel and offer advice to prevent smothering your best ideas with unnecessary tasks. They also explore team motivation and share the secret behind their enduring 20+ year working relationship. Tune in to learn how to seize the moment when inspiration strikes, make the most of it, and avoid wasting its potential. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the topic of the show today, from the book, Rework , the conversation is about the chapter called, "Inspiration is Perishable." [00:31] - Jason shares how to filter out which ideas are truly worthwhile and which ones are not. [01:48] - Inspiration is kind of like rocket fuel. David shares why he feels it’s important to act during the inspiration phase and which factors make inspiration perish most quickly. [04:37] - New projects need intense inspiration and a sprint mindset. [05:43] – How not to suffocate your inspiration right at the start. Jason shares why you should jump into action. [06:37] - Many successful ideas started as imperfect ones. David shares the key to making them successful. [07:33] - Inspiration ebbs and flows, Jason shares the key to knowing when a project is over and some advice from a piece he wrote called Faith in Eventually. [09:38] - Motivation is a valuable driver of success. David shares his philosophy on why you should prioritize the idea that excites you the most (even if it looks worse on paper). [10:37] - Don’t squander motivation on doubt—the importance of following your gut. [12:48] - Kimberly asks how David and Jason get the team excited and fired up for their new ideas. [13:13] - Everyone doesn’t have to be rah-rah fired up all the time. Jason shares his advice on what to focus on to keep a project progressing. [15:02] - Not everyone needs to be a visionary; there's a division of labor. David shares the need for a clear direction and decision-makers in every project. [17:11] - Kimberly asks if David and Jason tend to share inspiration simul
S2 E78 · Wed, October 11, 2023
You Don't Create a Culture
Company culture is more than just a buzzword or a section in your employee handbook. It's not something you can just write down and expect to manifest. It creates itself organically, through the attitudes and actions of your team that define how you work and more importantly how you work together. Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the Co-founders of 37signals, sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to share their perspective on the pivotal distinction between 'wanting' the right culture and actively 'doing the work' to foster a positive culture that truly reflects your values. Listen in as they share what they look for in character and contributions when hiring new members for the team and how they assess whether a person will enhance or detract from the company's culture and operations. And for those facing the tough question of whether their company culture ‘sucks’, they provide valuable insights into the hard choices, and uncomfortable conversations that drive meaningful culture change. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly kicks off the show, and a discussion focused on culture from the book Rework . [00:37] - Your organization’s culture creates itself. Jason shares what culture really represents, how it’s arrived at, and how to change it. [02:10] - It's easy to write down what you "want" your culture to be. David shares why that might be a mistake and why it's harder to "do the work" to create a positive culture. [04:28] - Kimberly shares her experience reading the company handbook when she began her career with 37signals and the impression it left. [05:01] - The goal is not perfection but consistently doing the right things to maintain a fair and representative culture. David shares why aligning your words and actions is crucial to shaping your organization's culture over time. [06:37] - Culture is show, it’s not tell. It’s the actual temperature of the organization, not the forecast. [07:11] - David asks if your culture passes the “smell test.” [07:36] - Kimberly shares a story about her husband’s experience in tech. She then asks how the team at 37signals has managed to create something so different from the industry standard. [08:09] - Standing against Silicon Valley's cultural norms for a more realistic approach to work hours and productivity. David recounts Basecamp's humble beginnings with limited time and resources that prompted 37signals to prioritize efficient time utilization over long hours. [11:43] - The human factor in culture. Kimberly asks whether the team considers how a new hire will align with the existing company culture. [12:05] - Jason shares what they look for in chara
S2 E77 · Wed, October 04, 2023
Hiring Senior Leaders, Getting Started with Six-Week Cycles, and Other Listener Questions
In this episode of Rework we're turning the spotlight onto you, our listeners, with another episode of listener questions. Today, Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, to pull back the curtain on the intricacies they faced when hiring a COO for their team, and the intuition-driven decision making they used to ensure their new hire would be a good fit and complement the team. Plus, how to help your company get started with working in six-week cycles, and adapting product development principles to professional services companies. Listen in to explore Jason and David's unconventional yet remarkably effective strategies for business development and growth. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the topic for today’s podcast, listener questions, with a question from Justin who asks, "I saw that you hired a COO in 2021 after not having someone in that role for a while. What’s the 37signals approach to executive hiring?" [00:46] - Jason discusses their decision to use a recruiter for hiring their new COO and shares which qualities were more important to them than the candidate's resume. [03:20] - David elaborates on the challenges of hiring executives, the importance of chemistry, and how Elaine complements their team. [06:41] - Reflecting on adding a third person to a team with a long history—why it was important to find someone who could introduce a dose of healthy conflict without making everything a grind. [08:07] - Jason shares how long the hiring process took, and what made them think that Elaine might be the right fit. [09:13] - David shares the importance of "gravitas"—having the weight and legitimacy to inspire trust and confidence in the team and how Elaine stood out compared to others in the hiring process. [10:44] - Kimberly shares this two-part question from Reuben: “What's your suggestion for helping a company get started with working in six-week cycles—is there a specific time to start? And are all the teams across 37signals synced on six-week cycles?” [11:07] - Jason shares his perspective on getting started with six-week cycles, his advice on when is a good time to start a cycle, and the one time he wouldn’t. [12:50] - David discusses the importance of individual focus in problem-solving and why he believes in starting with a small team to test Shape Up's effectiveness before implementing it company-wide. [15:41] - The benefits of having the entire company operate on the same clock frequency. [16:27] - Kimberly shares a question from a mystery caller asking for advice on adapting product development principles to professional services type companies, like public accounting or legal that work on hourly billing and tax deadlines or legal deadlines that they have to meet. [17:21] - Jason a
S2 E76 · Wed, September 27, 2023
37signals Introduces ONCE
In a world where subscriptions have become the norm for everything from streaming services to heated car seats, the team at 37signals recently unveiled a new venture that's poised to reintroduce the notion of software ownership with a pay-once model called ONCE. Today, Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals to introduce ONCE to listeners of the show. Listen in for a behind-the-scenes look at the driving principles, unique challenges, and potential impact of David and Jason's vision to offer simpler, more user-centric software, that they hope will transform the digital landscape and empower users worldwide. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly opens the show, with the team introducing ONCE today on the show. [00:25] - Jason clarifies exactly what ONCE is. [01:16] - Inundated with software subscriptions? Why 37signals is aiming to reintroduce software ownership with a pay-once model. [02:03] - The shift from software as a product to SaaS and why now is the time for an alternative. [02:58] - The distinction between product and service. [03:42] - When SaaS models just don’t fit (and when they lead to data ownership concerns). [04:56] - Basecamp in the White House? David shares the story. [05:57] - How transitioning from a service to a product model will change the landscape. [07:08] - Jason shares that ONCE is an umbrella for future products and offers listeners insight into the future of Basecamp and HEY . [09:18] -David shares the challenges of applying the ONCE idea to different software solutions. [11:38] - David shares the desire for a simpler and more straightforward user experience akin to turning on a TV. [13:22] - The need for a different software development approach, and why it will be a good time—even if it doesn't work. [14:51] - Kimberly inquires about the availability of the code. [15:42] - Jason highlights the transparency of the ONCE concept, sharing his hopes that it will serve as an educational tool for other product teams. [16:40] - David reflects on how newer products have lost their repairability, emphasizing the value of open source principles and the lasting legacy embodied by a product like ONCE. [20:41] - The importance and value of transparency and open collaboration. [21:47] - Kimberly raises questions about branding, the origin of the name ONCE, and the challenges of acquiring a short domain name. [21:51] - Jason shares some of the optional names they tried out and the philosophy behind the name ONCE. [22:40] - The process of acquiring premium domain names.
S2 E75 · Wed, September 20, 2023
Shape Up Principle: Decide When to Stop
In our recent episodes, we've been talking about the principles of Shape Up – the cornerstone of 37signals' product development philosophy. We've explored the art of crafting a pitch and the decision-making process that takes place at the betting table . Shape Up acknowledges that there's always more work than time allows, and on today’s episode, we’re zeroing in on a critical aspect of the Shape Up philosophy—when to stop tinkering and take the leap and ship. Join Kimberly Rhodes and 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson as they share their wisdom on the ever-present dilemma of shipping on time versus shipping perfect, and the fine balance between must-haves and nice-to-haves in product development. Plus, the value of Hill Charts in Basecamp to keep you tethered to the reality of where your project truly stands. Listen in as Jason and David provide practical strategies to master the art of timely product delivery that doesn't sacrifice quality to ensure your team stays on the path to success. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - There's always more work than there is time, and at some point, you must stop and ship and that's the topic of our conversation today. [00:44] - Jason talks about the importance of shipping on time without sacrificing quality. [02:29] - David uses a racing analogy to explain how viewing work through a budgeted timeframe helps you prioritize (and shed excess scope). [03:21] - The effectiveness of constraints in achieving better results. [04:18] - How embracing constraints leads to better software. [05:23] - How the two-person teams decide on "must haves" vs. "nice to haves." [07:51] - Constraints allow for reevaluation of the problem statement, highlighting that even the "epicenter" of a feature can be redefined, leading to scope reduction. [10:08] - How timelines keep you honest and keep you from chasing bad money. [11:47] - The value of "Hill Charts" in Basecamp and why complex issues on the other side of the hill pose a greater challenge. [12:44] - Jason explains that in the Shape Up methodology, if something isn't completed within the timeframe, it isn't automatically reintroduced—it has to fight for its relevance. [14:08] - How to avoid the "too big to fail." [14:21] - David explains how to use the "penalty box" concept to keep yourself honest in product development. [15:08] - The importance of guidelines and guardrails in getting you where you want to go. [19:08] - When should a project transition to a more form
S2 E74 · Wed, September 13, 2023
TypeScript Drama and Open Source Opinions
Recently 37signals co-founders David Heinemeier Hansson and Jason Fried found themselves at the center of an unexpected internet storm. It all began when David made a significant announcement: Turbo 8 would no longer be using TypeScript. What followed was a whirlwind of controversy and social media fireworks. In today's discussion, Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason and David to unpack the impact of social media on these types of discussions and the broader implications of these online controversies on open source contributions. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly opens up the discussion, sharing the recent announcement made by David, that Turbo 8 would no longer utilize TypeScript and the resulting online controversy. [00:33] - Jason shares his reaction to the drama unfolding and offers kudos to David for handling the storm with grace. [01:34] - David shares how it all began with eternal debate: dynamic vs. static languages, strong vs. weak typing, and 37signals is firmly in the dynamic, free-spirited camp. [02:23] - What led to the BIG decision to pull the TypeScript plug? [03:19] - Dynamic vs. static, it's like arguing about your favorite pizza topping. [04:13] - TypeScript was removed in record time (freeing the code!). [04:59] - This debate is like a merry-go-round of arguments (and we're not here to convert anyone). [05:48] - David shares: "People have preconceived notions about my opinions, and when we go against the flow, it's bound to stir the pot," (remember the cloud exit ?). [07:32] - Programmers can turn small details into raging infernos and social media is like a dry brush waiting for a spark. [08:45] - Compared to fighting Apple for HEY.com or navigating the minefield of workplace politics , this is just a minor skirmish. [10:38] - Humans naturally tend to form tribes and defend their beliefs, but internet drama usually loses its fervor in 24-36 hours. [11:38] - Jason shares the binary nature of most debates such as air-cooled vs. water-cooled Porsches or car collectors' preferences. [12:25] - Kimberly comments on the polarized nature of the comments. [12:38] - There is value in discussing ideas so long as the debates don’t devolve into personal attacks. [14:39] - How personal attacks gain traction. [15:44] - The importance of embracing diversity in programming languages and techniques for a more vibrant tech world. [17:24] - David shares insight from his recent trip to Japan and the beauty of appreciating different cultures without feeling th
S2 E73 · Wed, September 06, 2023
Shape Up Principle: The Betting Table
Picture this: a dimly lit room where velvet-robed figures gather in secret to make decisions of paramount importance as the fate of the pitches for the next product development cycle hangs in the balance. The "betting table” – where the formalized pitches for each six-week work cycle are selected – might seem mysterious but we're about to unravel its secrets. Listen in as host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to explore the unique inner workings of the "betting table" and how this process shapes each product development cycle. Tune in to discover 37signals' approach to selecting and refining projects at the "betting table." Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Today on the podcast, the discussion focuses on the betting table and how the decisions are made about which pitches are selected and which projects to schedule. [00:42] - Jason shares what the betting table is. [02:26] - The betting table process: refining pitches into a kickoff document. [03:17] - David shares the background behind the betting table and how it has evolved. [05:51] - The betting table: passionately advocating for different views, with one person ultimately making the decision. [06:51] - Ensuring that resource allocation decisions are made efficiently while avoiding committee-driven decision-making. [08:56] - Decisions made at the betting table can sometimes be passed to others who are more passionate or informed about a particular project. [10:04] - It's all about timing—unselected pitches don't automatically get another chance in the next cycle, but if they are relevant, they might. [10:51] - Jason shares his biggest issue with backlogs. [11:33] - David shares why Shape Up is such a powerful way of working and how the betting table process provides multiple opportunities to influence product direction. [14:38] - Jason shares how the assignment of team members works during the betting table to ensure that the available resources match the selected projects. [15:49] - David shares the background behind aligning pitch budgets with available resources and calendars during the betting table. [19:55] - Why so much of the betting table process is asynchronous and done via written communication, [22:54] - When calls might need to happen during the betting table process. [23:57] - For more background on how 37signals manages product development, get your free copy of the book Shape Up . It is available here. [24:13] - Don't forget you can still enter # TheU
S2 E72 · Wed, August 30, 2023
Shape Up Principle: Writing a Pitch
If you've been following the Rework podcast, you're undoubtedly acquainted with the concept of Shape Up, a cornerstone of 37signals' approach to product development. In this episode, we delve into a core component of Shape Up: the delicate art of crafting a pitch. Join Rework host Kimberly Rhodes as she sits down with 37signals founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson for a conversation encompassing everything from the essence and purpose of a pitch to the step-by-step process of constructing a finely tuned pitch. Listen in as Jason and David walk listeners through Shape Up's five-point compass for an effective pitch: problem, appetite, solution, rabbit holes, and no-gos, plus insight on how to use “tracer bullets” to manage the balance between scope and execution while avoiding the pitfalls along the way. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces listeners to Shape Up , and the topic of the day: "writing a pitch" for product development. [00:34] - Jason shares what a pitch is and its purpose in product development. [02:16] - David emphasizes a crucial counterpoint to common practices at most organizations, highlighting the two common pitfalls. [03:12] - Striking a balance: providing boundaries without stifling creativity. [04:05] - The key innovation of a Shape Up and the importance of avoiding extremes of over-specification or vague one-liners in your pitch. [05:44] - Jason shares who can write a pitch, and the distinction between throwing out ideas and formalized pitches. [07:47] - David introduces listeners to the concept of "framing" before pitching. [09:28] - Why it’s vital to distinguish between identifying a problem and crafting a pitch. [10:25] - Effective pitch creation requires contextual awareness to devise realistic solutions. [11:46] - Pitched solutions are more about direction than detailed execution—the true execution and implementation are the responsibility of the assigned team. [13:06] - Pitching is a powerful tool for attracting and nurturing independent decision-makers. [14:54] - The magic of deferring decisions until the implementation stage. [15:46] - Pitching projects is a blend of autonomy, mastery, and purpose, aligning with Daniel Pink's principles of employee satisfaction. [17:21] - Shape Up's five key details for making a pitch: problem, appetite, solution, rabbit holes, an
S2 E71 · Wed, August 23, 2023
Are You an Underdog? We want to hear from you!
In this episode of Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with 37signals founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to hear about the company's fondness for underdogs – small businesses that are scrappy, do more with less, and use creativity over big budgets. If this sounds like you, we'd love to hear from you and just might have you on an episode of Rework to share your story. Plus, the lucky winner will get one year of Basecamp Pro Unlimited on us! Here's what you need to know: How to Enter To participate, share your underdog story by commenting on the official contest post on LinkedIn or Twitter (X) . Your entry should include a single photo of your team in action and a description of your underdog story, with a maximum of 500 words. To complete your entry, you must either: Share your story on your own LinkedIn or Twitter profile using the hashtag #UnderdogChallenge and tag the official @37signals account in your post, or Fill out the form on Basecamp’s official “Underdog Challenge” contest page at basecamp.com/underdogchallenge . See the official contest rules for more details. Other Links: Basecamp's Old vs. New Campaign , focused on the underdog From Jason's HEY World: We Stand with the Underdogs
S2 E70 · Wed, August 09, 2023
Software Has Bugs
Bugs are an inevitable part of complex software and aiming for complete bug-free perfection is not only unrealistic, but it hinders progress and product delivery. In this episode of Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with 37signals founders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson to discuss why you need to be realistic about bugs in software development. Listen in as David and Jason offer a behind-the-scenes look at the two-tiered approach to handling bugs in their software at 37signals and their triage plan for determining which should be fixed, when, and by whom. Tune in to uncover strategies to manage your customers' expectations while dealing with bugs WITHOUT deviating from your product roadmap Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly opens the show and shares the topic for discussion, that bugs in software are normal. [00:27] - David shares why you need to be realistic about bugs in software development. [01:18] - Bugs, a natural side effect of software. [02:08] - What makes users abandon a piece of software (hint: it’s usually not a few bugs)? [05:26] - The two-tiered (non-emotional) approach to handling the vast spectrum of bugs in complicated pieces of software. [06:13] - When is a “bug” not a “bug”? [07:00] - Handling customer expectations without screwing up your product roadmap. [07:52] - You need a filter: the double-edged sword of founders operating in customer support. [08:32] - David shares a behind-the-scenes look triage at 37signals. [09:31] - The novel QA approach of the Toyota production line that 37signals tries to emulate. [11:37] - Jason shares the difference between the software and auto industries when fixing production problems. [12:37] - Yes, quality matters, but perfect never gets shipped. [14:30] - So how do we build useful, meaningful software? [15:21] - Breaking out of bad bug thought patterns so you can keep making software of value. [16:47] - Who oversees fixing the bugs at 37signals—the methods they use to determine what gets fixed, when, and by who. [20:08] - Cleaning up the tech debt: the vital importance of a measured, mature way of scheduling things. [21:09] - Don't create ****** software—it can’t be fixed. [23:55] – Jason discusses the idea an organization might be a bigger problem than just a bug in the software. [24:44] - Why you should never become "too big" to listen to your customers. [26:28] – For more, check out our Dev.37signals blog, where the 37signals developers write about some of their proc
S2 E69 · Wed, August 02, 2023
Rescuing A Project In Progress
Knowing when you're in over your head and recognizing when a project has gone off the rails are crucial aspects of successful project management. But what are the red flags to watch for to prevent project derailment and how can you tell if a project is doomed to fail—even before you start? This week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the challenges of project management and share valuable insights on how to stay focused, recognize red flags early on, and foster creative problem-solving in order to see a project through to completion. Listen in as they reveal the importance of finishing tasks before adding new ones, the pitfalls of multitasking, and the magic of setting clear endpoints. Plus they share Basecamp's tool for facilitating project monitoring without time-consuming meetings or derailing check-ins. Tune in for practical solutions for rescuing a project before it's too late! Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly opens the show and the topic of how to rescue a project when it’s gone off of the rails. [00:34] - Adding too much without finishing anything causes chaos. Jason shares the story behind his HEY World piece, Rescuing a project in progress , and shares the advice he gave his friend and how that applies to software development too. [02:49] - David shares the reasons behind the “Shape Up” approach at 37signals. [03:44] - You can’t do two things at once, every time you do you lose a little bit… [04:33] - Clearing the decks, wiping the slate clean, AND deciding what you are going to do with 100% of your time and how it helps you avoid shiny object syndrome. [05:20] - Why it's crucial for successful project management to avoid adding new tasks until all the existing unfinished ones are completed. [06:11] - How the magic of deciding when you’re done helps lower the risk of multitasking. [08:53] - In software development how can you tell things are going off the rails before it’s way too late? [09:17] - Jason shares why you need to be tuned into those feelings of being in over your head. [10:43] - David shares the major red flag moment for him that lets him know you’ve already failed before you even get started. [12:28] - “The longer, the more complicated the project, the more deceivingly specific people believe they can be when the opposite should actually be true.” [13:17] - Why you should never give yourself too much time for a project. [14:13] - The work-in-progress unified system in Denmark for tax assessments of prop
S2 E68 · Wed, July 26, 2023
The Google Graveyard
Unlike some tech giants that have notoriously pulled the plug on beloved products (remember Google's sudden discontinuation of Google Reader?), 37signals takes a vastly different approach with their pledge to support ALL of their products for the life of the internet. This week host Kimberly Rhodes sits down with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, to explore the importance of longevity and trust in the SaaS industry. Drawing parallels to iconic brands like Porsche and Rolex, Jason and David take a deep dive into the challenges of product discontinuation and its impact on loyal customers. From Ta-da List to Basecamp, listen in as they reveal the principles that drive their support decisions and why longevity matters when building a brand that customers will rely on for decades. Check out the full video episode on YouTube Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the podcast and the topic of 37signals' core principle to maintain its products until the end of the internet. [00:36] - David discusses the risk of relying on big companies for software services, sharing the recent example of Google killing off its domain selling service. [02:06] - David explains why Google tends to abandon services leaving users to deal with the aftermath. [03:50] - How to become a legacy brand—like Porsche. [05:20] - David shares 37signal's philosophy to keep products running until the end of the internet (example: 17 years of maintaining Ta-da List). [06:08] - Short-term profitability vs. long-term commitment to customers: The moral obligation (and trade-off) of maintaining legacy products. [08:07] - Kimberly draws a parallel between the changing ownership of mortgages and software services. [08:58] - Brand building through commitment and longevity. [10:05] - Jason shares how 37signals prioritizes their commitment to customers with their core apps. [12:16] - The challenge of balancing the desires of existing customers with the need to appeal to new customers. [15:47] - The most profitable product in the 37signals portfolio. [17:37] - Kimberly asks about the decision-making process between creating new versions of Basecamp versus adding features to the existing ones. [18:02] - Some updates are like facelifts—others involve fundamental changes. [20:20] - The costs involved in maintaining apps like Ta-da List. [21:35] - David highlights the BIG return on investment in brand power that comes with the commitment to maintaining products. [23:12] - How the murder of Google Reader still impacts users' trust in new Google products a decade later. [24:06] - The high failure rate of venture-backed companies. [23:48] - Did you know full video of episodes of Rework are available? <a
S2 E67 · Wed, July 19, 2023
Be Careful Who You Listen To
In today's fast-paced information-saturated world, advice is abundant, but it can be difficult to determine which sources are truly reliable. This week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, join host Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the challenges of navigating the ever-growing sea of advice and how to choose the right guidance for your journey. Listen in as they share their thoughts on the expiration date of advice, the dangers of following someone else's prescribed path, and the value of trusting your own instincts. Watch the Full Episode on Video Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly opens the show and introduces listeners to the topic of finding reliable business advice in today’s digital age. [00:40] - Jason shares why he wrote Advice Expires and why he and David are the wrong people to ask for advice about starting a business. [02:14] - David shares how the Internet's craving for content leads to conflicting advice and the value of trusting your own instincts. [04:16] - Ignore more advice than you take: turning the tide on the trend of collecting mentors and seeking advice from multiple sources. [05:04] - The value of being outside the Silicon Valley bubble. [05:44] - The importance of cultivating originality. [06:15] - The danger of following everyone else's formula for success. [07:38] - How the "Pinterestization" of our culture is diluting originality in favor of popularity. [09:48] - The mystery behind success—Jason shares why you must be mindful of blindly emulating successful companies or individuals. [10:52] - David discusses the “ Halo Effect ” and how success in one aspect doesn't necessarily mean excellence in all areas. [11:41] - The “awesomeness tradeoff”: how the book “ Blue Ocean Strategy ” puts a method to the idea that you can't be awesome at all the things all the time. [13:12] - Kimberly raises the issue of self-proclaimed experts on the Internet. [14:13] - Why "Rework" was so successful. [14:50] - The importance of a select set of core ideas or key values for more effective decision-making in a sea of options. [16:13] -T
S2 E66 · Wed, July 12, 2023
Leaving the Cloud: The Finale
You’ve no doubt heard the 37signals team talking about leaving the cloud . Well, now the transition is complete! In this episode of Rework, 37signals co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson and Director of Operations Eron Nicholson sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the unexpected speed of the move, the decisions, the hurdles they faced, and the behind the scenes of the meticulous process of moving their major applications, including those that had never before been run outside the cloud. Tune in as they share the secrets behind their successful approach and the unexpected trick that allowed them to tackle individual components without risking major disruptions. Plus, they address questions from listeners, covering topics such as backups, physical resets, and the future of their infrastructure. Listen in for an eye-opening conversation that challenges the prevailing narratives of the cloud era and delves into the untapped potential of running your own infrastructure. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly sits down with 37signals co-founder and CTO David Heinemeier Hansson, and director of operations, Eron Nicholson to discuss 37signals move away from the cloud. [00:39] - David shares their surprise at the quick completion of the move and the challenges they faced in planning and technology decisions. [01:26] - Out in six months: how the team, led by Eron, tackled the various aspects such as logging, failover, and managing two data centers while resolving numerous open questions along the way. [03:06] - An opportunity to question existing principles and processes, resulting in a novel approach. It felt like a product launch! [05:04] - Eron reflects on the accelerated timeline and how the entire ops and SIP team worked towards the same goal. [06:32] - How the criticality ladder approach allowed for smoother progress to more complex applications like Basecamp Classic. [08:47] - Eron explains the logistics and the unexpected trick that helped the team tackle individual components without risking significant disruptions. [10:52] - Moving HEY, 37signals most critical and complex app, that had never before been run outside the cloud. [11:23] - Kimberly opens the floor to a few user questions from Twitter, the first one from Pedro: "Did your company buy or already own your own data centers, or are you renting space in existing data centers? Is that even an option?" [11:50] - Running your own data center requires a gargantuan scale and enormous investment, but renting space in data centers makes it easy and capital-efficient. [14:29] - Amnesia of the pre-cloud era: using data centers is more accessible than most people think. [15:38] - Eron shares
S2 E65 · Wed, July 05, 2023
Two-Person Teams: Listener Questions
This week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, join host Kimberly Rhodes to answer listener questions from the recent episode about Two-Person Teams. They tackle topics ranging from two-person team collaboration techniques to their innovative approach to team cooldown periods and the benefits for individuals and the overall project workflow. Listen in as they discuss their journey in refining the on-call process and the power of "spring cleaning" to address unresolved issues. Tune in to this episode for valuable advice based on questions asked by listeners like you. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly dives into today’s episode with more listener questions sourced from various platforms beginning with Kenneth from LinkedIn and his question about how a two-person team can be resilient to vacation, sickness, and turnover. [00:42] - Jason shares how having multiple two-person teams and time-boxed cycles allows for handling absences. [02:52] - "Scope is this magical flexible bubble of energy that you can squeeze into different size containers." [04:24] - A viewer on YouTube responds to David's remarks about trust in teams by asking if there are any prerequisites for trustworthy individuals. [04:51] - The critical foundation of a long-term collaboration: David shares why trusting employees is a worthwhile investment and how to establish the right boundaries within your organization to build trust. [08:30] - How the concept of the "trust battery" (introduced by Toby from Shopify) helps in understanding the dynamics of trust and its impact on relationships and perceptions. [10:02] - Trust is a gradual process that allows individuals to gain confidence and demonstrate their readiness for higher levels of responsibility. [11:23] - The next question comes from a voicemail inquiring about how Quality Assurance (QA) and testing are handled at 37signals and the interaction between QA and the six-week cycles of the Shape Up paradigm. [12:16] - David reveals the priorities of 37signal's recently revamped QA approach with two QA team members and no more reliance on external vendors. [13:12] - The importance of customer data using the example of the launch of a card table feature in Basecamp. [16:27] - You are responsible for your own work; the QA team is there to find the edge cases, not the other way around. [17:18] - QA (like many things) is everyone's job: how the 37signals model helps individuals level up more quickly AND ensures that the quality is right when things ship. [18:26] - Justice, a fan of Jason and David's books and products, emailed a question about how 37signals handles bugs, smaller tasks, and standalone features that vary in time requirements. [19:10] - Clearing up the confusion about the 6-week rule. The distinction between proactive and reactive work and ensur
S2 E64 · Wed, June 28, 2023
When to Jump into AI
When should small business owners start paying attention to AI? Is immediate action necessary, or are we already behind? In today's episode, 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with host Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the landscape of AI and its implications for businesses. From the impact on small business owners to the ever-present question of falling behind, David and Jason explore the potentials and limitations of AI and its present and future impact on how we use technology. Tune in to learn how Jason and David are currently using AI and the importance of curiosity and safety when implementing AI tools in your business. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the topic of AI and its relevance to small business owners. [00:41] - Jason emphasizes curiosity over fear and reassures listeners that they are not falling behind in the world of AI. [01:26] - David acknowledges the hype and FOMO surrounding AI but highlights how easy it is to get started. [02:00] - The incredible potential and rapid evolution of AI. [03:15] - Jump in and explore AI without feeling left behind. [04:10] - The key to using AI effectively. [05:07] - The fast rate of change means there’s a lot we don’t know. [06:00] - “If you don't understand what's being produced, you'll hit the wall relatively quickly in terms of what you can do with it.” [06:46] - How often do you get to live during a time of this much uncertainty? Embrace it, but … [07:47] - AI is a big parlor trick right now. Jason shares why his best advice is to have fun with AI and some ways he's used it. [09:14] - Will Jason and David be bringing AI into 37signals? [09:57 ] - Beyond the smartphone—A potential shift in how we interact with technology. [10:55 ] - Using three paragraphs when two lines will do…the awful business language verbose bullshit AI is currently churning out is a hilarious critique of corporate business-speak. [13:32 ] - How can businesses safely implement AI tools right now? [13:49 ] - "It's not like just going to a genie in the cloud." Why it's essential to be mindful of your personal data when using AI. [15:48 ] - The REWORK podcast is now on YouTube. Subscribe here. “ Rework ” is a production of 37signals . You can find show notes and transcripts on our website at 37signals.com/podcast . If you have a question for David and Jason about running a business, leave a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or <a href='http://
S2 E63 · Wed, June 21, 2023
Buckets of Time
Time is a valuable resource that often leaves us longing for more hours to conquer our ever-expanding to-do lists. The relentless stream of emails, meetings, and responsibilities can easily hijack our concentration, reminding us that while we have 24 hours at our disposal, we don't have 24 hours of attention a day. In this episode of the Rework podcast, 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with Kimberly Rhodes to present the concept of "bucketing" your time to make the most of your valuable hours. Tune in as Jason and David share their personal experiences with effective time bucketing, how they've successfully applied this strategy at 37signals, and the unique features offered by HEY , that allow users to manage their email within designated time buckets. Listen in to learn about the transformative power of time bucketing and escape the chaotic distractions for more control over your schedule, enhanced productivity, and a more balanced approach to work. Show Notes: [00:00] - Time is our most precious resource, today, Jason and David sit down with Kimberly to talk about the concept of bucketing your time. [00:39] - David shares how he most effectively buckets his time using one of the best features of HEY . [01:38] - How bucketing time helps teach you about efficiency and places limits on the amount of time you spend on specific tasks while still providing value. [03:27] - Jason shares the key to bucketing your time efficiently. [04:24] - The key to staying consciously focused. [05:24] - The difference between moving projects forward and just “doing stuff.” [06:17] - Squandered time creates a recipe for dread and dissatisfaction with work. [07:19] - Jason shares why he says no to attention-splintering obligations. [08:50] - “It's not just about time. It's about the commitment that you make, that you will not change your mind during that short period of time.” [09:32] - Bucketing time is for individuals, teams, and organizations who want to avoid the whiplash of being pulled back and forth and into and out of things. [10:11] - Why committing to completing is the key to moving forward. [10:50] - Time and attention are very different things, and while you have 24 hours a day, you don't have 24 hours of attention a day. [12:30] - Humans don’t multitask: David shares the behind-the-scenes cost of breaking the flow. [13:21] - How 37signals has only three programmers working on features for Basecamp AND they're shipping stuff every six weeks. [14:34] - It starts at the top—ho
S2 E62 · Wed, June 14, 2023
Twitter is Still Up
It's been more than seven months since Elon Musk purchased Twitter. Since then, a reported 80% of the company has been let go, reducing their staff from just under 8,000 employees to around 1,500. With all that turmoil, many believed that Twitter would fail completely or stop working, but Twitter's still up! Today, host Kimberly Rhodes, Jason Fried, and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down to delve into the aftermath of Elon's controversial acquisition of Twitter, the surprises and lessons learned from this transformative event, and an exploration of the question, how many people do you really need to run your company effectively? Tune in as they share insights into their own experiences at 37signals and offer valuable lessons for entrepreneurs and business owners on the impact of Twitter's restructuring. Listen in as Jason and David discuss the resilience of Twitter, their initial predictions for the company, and the evolving dynamics of company size and efficiency. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the topic of today's show, which is all things Twitter, and asks, how many employees do you need? [00:55] - Jason shares that the fundamental point of view is that companies need fewer employees than they think. [01:41] - While there were casualties in terms of job losses, the system of Twitter still works—you don't need as many employees as you might think. [02:28] - When building a company, the lesson is to avoid hiring more people than necessary. [03:03] - David shares, “Twitter was morbidly obese.” The lesson is clear: Less is more, and lighter teams can move faster. [04:11] - The Twitter downsizing experiment is a real-life revelation. [05:30] - In stagnant organizations, some individuals may have had "bullshit jobs" that did not impact the company or customers. [07:01] - "Representative of the kind of company that Twitter was, I can totally see how they had six and a half thousand too many people." Plus, a former Twitter employee's experience highlights the depth of the issue (not a single thing that person had worked on ever made it into production). [09:00] - The primary advantage of being small is speed—it’s just physics—and it's business. [09:52] - The valuable lessons to be learned from Twitter. [10:24] - One of the most controversial decisions made by Musk that sparked widespread debate and contestation. [11:21] - One of the novel case studies of the entire tech history—reminiscent of when Steve Jobs returned to Apple in 1997. [12:21] - Speaking of Mr. Jobs - how he pared Apple down to the four things he thought Apple needed to be a top-tier company (and got rid of the bloat). [13:24] - Quoting another social media tech titan on Twitter prior to Musk's takeover. [14:43] - “Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery’—spawni
S2 E61 · Wed, June 07, 2023
It’s Time to Care About Costs
In a time when many companies are disregarding profitability and spending recklessly, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson have taken a different approach at 37signals. They believe that caring about costs is a timely concern and a fundamental principle for running a successful small business. In this episode of the “Rework” podcast, they sit down with Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the critical importance of cost management in today's business landscape. From reevaluating software subscriptions to establishing fixed pricing models, listen in as Jason and David share their proactive approach to cost management. They discuss strategies for navigating the dangers of unchecked expenses and eliminating unnecessary expenditures and their detrimental effects on a company’s long-term viability. Tune in as Jason and David share their practical insights and hard-won wisdom for building a sustainable AND profitable business in any economic climate. Show Notes: [00:00] - Kimberly introduces the episode and opens today's discussion on the importance of caring about costs in business. [00:49] - As the availability of money is decreasing, companies are starting to realize the importance of profitability. [02:22] - Jason discusses the difficulty of shifting into a cost-conscious mindset and the common first steps of cutting costs. [03:39] - How to ensure profitability. [04:41] - David shares their experience during the dot-com boom and bust, which influenced their mindset of never wanting to be financially vulnerable. [06:24] - Why smaller bootstrap businesses must cultivate cost-conscious habits early on. [07:16] - Money buys independence (options, time, and flexibility). [08:07] - Redefining what makes financial sense and prioritizing cost-effectiveness—even if it's not your money. [08:50] - Companies are facing the harsh reality of survival. It’s time to focus on maintainable practices before it all comes crashing down. [09:40] - An opportunity to rein in wasteful spending for a more sustainable future. [10:37] - Without occasional controlled burns, the forest of technology becomes a ticking time bomb. [11:21] - A startup in Denmark is facing the end of their runway in just nine months—how they could extend their runway twofold. [12:19] - Kimberly shares about the caution-to-carelessness cycle that happens as small businesses begin to thrive. [12:43] - Jason shares how hard it is to break free from the spend-centric growth-chasing culture, especially when fueled by other people’s money. [14:13] - The "spend it all" mentality that creates a Monopoly-style illusion masking financial responsibility. [14:48] - The habit of spending is easily acquired, but making more than you spend is the real challenge, and in the next 18 months, companies la
S2 E60 · Wed, May 31, 2023
Two Person Teams
If you've been following along with the podcast, you've heard the mention of two-person teams and how 37signals makes the most of its software features and productivity with just two people working together—one programmer and one designer. In this episode of the Rework podcast, 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down with Kimberly Rhodes to dive deeper into the concept of two-person teams and share valuable insights on the benefits, challenges, and strategies behind their unique approach. Listen in as Jason and David share the importance of short-term cycles, the significance of building their own tools for maximum efficiency, and how these principles shape their company's operations. They also discuss the expansion of two-person teams into other areas of the organization and the limitations of working as a team of one. Tune in to discover how the power of two can revolutionize teamwork and productivity. Show Notes: [00:00] - Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson are here to discuss the concept of smaller teams and how two-person teams are effective at 37signals. [00:48] - Jason shares that initially, teams at 37signals had three people, including two programmers and one designer, and why they changed to two people on each six-week cycle project. [01:33] - The constraint of having two people is not a resource issue but rather an opportunity to tighten project scopes and prioritize ideas. Direct communication between the programmer and designer eliminates translation layers and allows for efficient progress. [02:14] - How the direct collaboration of two-person teams sharing the same workspace enables rapid progress. [02:53] - David shares how working with web technologies improves two-person teams' efficiency and helps avoid delays caused by platform approvals or updates. [03:49] - The significant advantage for 37signals is that it eliminates the need for conversions. [04:44] - Enhancing the bandwidth between the two team members by removing obstacles and maximizing direct communication—how 37signals realized that having five programmers for Basecamp was too many. [05:40] - Blowing the minds of startups who think they need an army of programmers—the secrets of 37signals' productivity. [06:31] - New members easily integrate into the productive system, proving that anyone can embrace this approach. [06:45] - Two-person team pairings at 37signals are flexible—some stay together, some don't. [09:06] - Embracing the freedom of the two-person team approach by setting aside daily stand-ups and rigid check-ins in favor of a balance of oversight and support without unnecessary bureaucracy. [10:19] - The secret behind 37signals' unique management approach—how management, driven by processes rather than people, creates a more efficie
S2 E59 · Wed, April 19, 2023
Listener Questions Part 3
On the previous episode of the Rework podcast, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, joined host Kimberly Rhodes to answer listener questions and share their insights on various topics such as project ownership, attracting talent, and building a successful team. This week, they return to address one question that deserved its own episode. Tune in as they reflect on a significant reset that occurred at 37signals in 2021 when many people left the company simultaneously due to a "no politics on work forums" stance. They discuss how they dealt with the high turnover rate and how that pivotal moment became the catalyst that caused them to reassess and make necessary changes to their company culture. Plus, what they learned about the importance of making bold moves to drive progress and overcome stagnation. Show Notes: [00:15] - Kimberly shares a listener question from a cardiac surgeon, Jeffrey Gibson, about the employee resignations at 37signals in 2021 when they implemented a "no politics on work forums" policy and asks for an update about how the policy is working. [01:24] - David discusses the importance of time in evaluating a decision and his pride in the decision. He highlights the positive outcomes that have resulted from it. [03:27] - David talks about renegotiating the separation between work and home and how this decision has helped to clarify the company's focus and values. [05:51] - The media gets involved: David shares his experience with media reports and how it has changed his perspective on them. [06:31] - "My personal sense is that the media, in general, has been covering itself in glory for a bit now, not just on that point, but on a lot of points." - David Heinemeier Hansson [07:23] - One of the most important and difficult decisions they have made as a company (and the positive outcomes for their workplace culture). [10:06] - A few regrets: Jason shares that the decision-making process during that time taught him to be careful about making other decisions in a fog and encourages others to project ahead and look back before making a decision. [11:38] - Kimberly asks if turnover allowed them a fresh start with changing the company culture. [12:00] - A mass exodus and a major reset. [13:22] - An opportunity to consider what matters—David explains how going through something challenging offers the chance to reassess your life, what you stand for, and where you're going. [14:53] - David discusses how difficult it is to ask big questions in daily life and how companies go through a similar process of reassessing what they want to be, what they stand for, and where they want to go. [15:38] - David reflects on the fruits of the company's
S2 E58 · Wed, April 12, 2023
Listener Questions Part 2
On last week's Rework podcast, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, joined host Kimberly Rhodes to answer listener questions about their approach to design, decision-making, and more. Today, they return to tackle more listener questions, covering a diverse range of topics such as delegating projects, hiring, and remote work. Listen in as they discuss their strategies for helping team members take ownership of their work and their tips on deploying projects. They also offer advice on attracting and retaining the right talent and discuss the role of communication and culture in building a successful team. Show Notes: [00:26] - Sarah McKenzie asks for tips on delegating projects rather than tasks and helping team members take ownership of their work areas as she wants to move in this direction with her small team. [01:23] - Jason explains how Basecamp delegates projects instead of tasks . In contrast, team members are given a rough general idea of the project and some ideas for the interface design, and they figure out how to get it done in their own time. [02:57] - David adds that even new employees and junior programmers can handle owning a whole project. [04:38] - David shares that Shape Up's idea of a fixed time frame and flexible scope interlocks with delegating projects. [05:32] - Let people live up to high expectations and see who does it quickly and best. Delegating a project means evaluating work based on outcomes, not effort, allowing team members to make decisions and run autonomously within the project's scope. [06:28] - Julio Caesar from Sao Paulo, Brazil, asks DHH about the day-to-day work in a team of two, specifically about code review, pull requests, and dev to production deployments. He's concerned about the time wasted in long change management meetings and how to avoid having someone who doesn't know anything about the project approve a deploy. [07:11] - 37signals has teams of two working on different aspects of a product, with any given feature having a designer and a programmer working on it. [08:24] - David shares that the company has a process where someone is responsible for the quality of the work that goes out the door. There is a mentorship process for new hires. Programmers and designers review each other's work. [08:40] - In the Seven Shipping Principles , there is a notion that if the person is confident that the deploy is low-risk, they are not obligated to get a review. Even CTOs and senior employees sometimes request a review to increase their confidence. The team encourages individual
S2 E57 · Wed, March 29, 2023
Listener Questions / AMA
In this episode of Rework, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, join host Kimberly Rhodes to answer questions posed by Rework listeners. Listen in as they share their insights and experiences in running a successful software company by answering questions from podcast listeners on topics such as 37signals' approach to design, decision-making processes, product management, and balancing managerial roles and responsibilities. Tune in to hear their unique perspectives on these key aspects of building a successful software company. Show Notes: [00:23] - Noel asks David and Jason about their philosophy on design systems and using components instead of reinventing the wheel every time. [01:01] - Jason explains that 37signals' website is a collection of ideas. The product itself is their design system. [03:07] - As with Basecamp and Hey, design consistency can emerge naturally. [03:30] - David shares that large organizations typically use design systems to standardize processes. [05:34] - Why it makes sense for individual designers to have ownership over the design process for small teams like 37signals. [06:52] - Listener Paul asks how David and Jason resolve conflicts and make difficult decisions. [07:02] - Jason explains conflicts are rare among the team and shares how they handle the things they don't agree on (without keeping score). [08:18] - Why it's important to remember most decisions are temporary. [08:59] - Jason shares an example of the rare occurrences when they might battle. [09:49] - Setting the standards for a smooth workflow. [11:30] - David's philosophy: "A willingness to try anything as long as there's an expiration on the experiment and a way to tell whether it went one way or the other." [12:55] - Jason explains why they don't need to consult each other for every decision—even the BIG ones, like leaving the cloud . [14:28] - Prioritizing independence, competency, and TRUST. [16:50] - Podcast listener Tim asks Jason and David to discuss 37signals' approach to product management and some of their methods over the years. [17:20] - David shares how using software to gather and distribute information, allowing teams to make decisions, leads to everyone rowing in the same boat. [20:19] - Jason adds that with two-person teams, there is a direct relationship between the programmer and designer, and management would get in the way. [22:21] - Fighting hard against traditional managerial responsibilities because having managers invent work for other people can wreck a good thing (David and Jason only wear the hats of CTO and CEO occasionally). [23:25] - Do you have questions for David and Jason a
S2 E56 · Wed, March 22, 2023
Taking a Sabbatical as a Business Owner
In this episode of Rework, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, join host Kimberly Rhodes to discuss the power of taking sabbaticals as business owners. Jason recently returned to work after taking his first sabbatical in nearly 23 years. He and David share their experiences and insights on the benefits of taking extended breaks from work. They cover the challenges of stepping away from a business you've built, the importance of trusting your team to handle things in your absence, and the value of returning to work with a fresh perspective. Listen in to hear their practical advice for business owners considering taking a sabbatical and the positive impact time away can have on both individuals and the company. Show Notes: [00:43] - Jason shares why he took his first sabbatical in nearly 23 years and how disconnecting completely from work gave him a new perspective. [01:49] - David shares his forced sabbatical experience when he had to move to Denmark. He shares his opinion that it's healthy for the organization's resiliency to have its founders step out. [04:41] - Why feeling like you can't take a vacation is unhealthy. [05:46] - Disconnecting during a sabbatical: Jason shares his experience that portrays the importance of taking time off and what he did during reentry to avoid overwhelm. [08:08] - David emphasizes the importance of taking a REAL break and trusting others to carry on, so you can return to work with a clearer mind and a better perspective on what truly matters. [09:57] - Jason shares why, if anything had to wait for him to return to be decided, it might be a symptom of overreliance on any one individual. [10:30] - Kimberly shares why there's usually a scramble to get things done before a regular vacation and asks how preparing for a sabbatical differs. [11:27] - Jason shares the writing he did before taking off. [12:23] - David shares his realization that there are big foundational tenants of how they work that will stay the same, even if one of the principles is out for an extended time. [14:00] - Shifting the work to get projects where more people can independently drive them. [16:38] - Don't fear the sabbatical: remember, you are not as important as you think. Jason advises people to trust their team. [17:53] - The importance of enjoying boredom: David shares how sabbaticals allow the mind enough space to work on the business in your head and remind you why you do what you do. [19:47] - It's time to answer those questions! Kimberly announces that next week's podcast episode will answer listener questions. Leave your voicemails at 708-628-7850 or send an email with questions about a better way to work and run your business. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 70
S2 E55 · Wed, March 08, 2023
Leaving the Cloud Part 2
In October 2022, 37signals announced they would transition off cloud services in a post titled "Why We're Leaving the Cloud." Despite the advantages of the cloud, the downsides were too significant for the company. In this follow-up episode to Leaving the Cloud on REWORK , co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson and Director of Operations Eron Nicholson discuss the progress 37signals has made since they decided to leave the cloud. Listen in as they delve into the pros and cons of using the cloud versus owning your hardware and some of the misconceptions people have about cloud costs and expertise. Tune in as the pair shares insights from their experience running web applications at scale and offer advice, tips, and tools for startups and businesses looking to optimize their infrastructure. Join the discussion as they explore the importance of getting real about the costs of the cloud for small businesses. Show Notes: [00:49] - David reflects on the progress made since the announcement to transition off of cloud services. And why their initial plan for help with the transition didn't work for 37signals' needs. [01:37] - How the experience with the failed deal to get help with the cloud transition reinforced the idea of why 37signals wanted to leave the cloud. [02:33] - David shares some tools that can be used to move out of the cloud, including Docker and Kubernetes. [04:21] - Why 37signals opted for a new tool they built called Kamal to assist in their transition and their timeline for being entirely out of the cloud. [06:11] - Bleeding money: The $38,000 motivator to speed up the timeline and free up cash that could be better spent elsewhere in the business. [08:33] - The tools: Eron and David discuss the tools (Docker and Kamal) they've used to successfully move two apps, Tadalist and Writeboard, from the cloud to their new system and the template in place for moving the rest of their apps. [11:08] - David discusses the criticality ladder they have in place to prioritize their move off the cloud, beginning with the lowest criticality app (Tadalist) before moving on to higher criticality apps like Hey, which deals with email and must always be available to users. [13:23] - The app transition plan for the next few months. [13:58] - Eron explains the challenges of staffing up for a project of this magnitude. He also highlights how many of their current AWS-related processes will become streamlined once they have their own infrastructure. [16:00] - David shares what the cloud is great for, why it doesn't work great for middle-range SaaS companies, and the main reasons for 37signals for bringing their infrastructure back i
S2 E54 · Wed, March 01, 2023
The Power of Time Off
Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founders of 37signals, advocate for taking extended breaks from work, as outlined in their book "It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work ." While this practice is relatively common in many parts of the world, it's less common in North America. In this episode of Rework, host Kimberly Rhodes is joined by Jeff Hardy, a programmer at 37signals, as he shares his experience taking a one-month sabbatical and discusses the benefits of stepping away from work to refresh your mind. Tune in as Jeff offers advice on establishing boundaries and disconnecting from work while on vacation to maintain a healthy work-life balance and tips for smoothly transitioning back into work after an extended absence. Show Notes: [00:47] - Jeff introduces himself and how his role in product development at 37signals has evolved over the last 15 years. [01:29] - Jeff shares why you need to be in the right mindset to avoid burnout and remain effective in your work. [04:02] - Learn from Jeff as he shares effective strategies to disconnect from work and fully embrace your sabbatical with these helpful tips. [06:07] - The two outcomes of extended time away from work. [06:52] - Why Jeff ended his sabbatical during a meetup. [07:59] - Jeff reveals the transformative power of taking a break and how it can lead to a profound shift in your perspective [09:54] - The key to understanding (and accepting) that you are not that important. [10:56] - The importance of perspective: learn to see your job is just a portion of your life, not your whole life. [12:33] - Jeff shares his tips for effectively utilizing vacation time to disconnect from work and refresh your mind. [13:46] - The ingredients you need for a successful work story. [15:04] - Discover how taking a sabbatical can provide a much-needed break without a complete disconnect. [15:40] - Jeff shares his key takeaways from his sabbatical and the lessons he learned about himself and his job. [17:35] - Do you have a question for Jason and David or anyone at 37signals? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer it on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work HEY World | HEY Dev.37signals Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast</e
S2 E53 · Wed, February 22, 2023
The Challenges of Remote Work
Remote work has become increasingly popular in recent years, offering several benefits, such as increased flexibility and the ability to work anywhere globally. However, there are some challenges that come with remote work and it’s certainly not for all companies. In this episode of the Rework podcast, 37signals co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss these issues and how they've overcome them from their book, Rework . They share insights on how to work together across different time zones, ways to stay connected while working remotely, and the benefits of remote work for both employees and employers. Listen in to find out what remote work has to offer, along with its challenges and benefits, from two seasoned advocates. Show Notes: [00:36] - 37signals is as remote as they've ever been. [01:02] - The challenges of time zones in a remote work environment, especially when training or mentoring new employees. [02:22] - Jason discusses the importance of scheduling and pairing employees with compatible time zones, depending on their experience level. [03:57] - David shares why from his perspective, four hours is the ideal amount of time zone overlap for remote collaboration. [05:32] - Why it's essential to be strategic about where you hire from, given the challenges of time zone differences. [06:13] - While asynchronous communication is useful, synchronous communication is needed to crack through some tasks. [07:52] - How 37signals twice-yearly meetups are more of an investment than an expense, unlike the cost of an office. [08:35] - Humans are not built for fully remote work—why meeting in person is necessary to reduce loneliness, recharge batteries, and create better team relationships. [10:57] - Why simply installing communication tools like Slack and Zoom without changing work practices offers the worst of both worlds and results in a subpar remote work experience. [12:20] - The potential pitfalls and tradeoffs of the new hybrid work model. [14:10] - The benefits of being able to hire the best talent from anywhere in the world and allowing employees the freedom to live and work in multiple locations. [16:22] - Jason discusses why some companies are requiring employees to return to the office after the pandemic and both advantages and disadvantages. [17:46] - David shares why either way is OK—some companies thrive with having an in-person culture catering to the needs of employees who prefer working in an office, while there should be more remote work options for those who prefer working from home. [20:38] - Busting the myth that remote work is impossible, creating more options for people, but the future of work remains to be seen. [22:39] - Leave a v
S2 E52 · Wed, February 15, 2023
Hire Great Writers
Writing is crucial for communication and collaboration in both remote and in-person organizations. But how do you find and hire great writers? Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down to share why writing is at the heart of the success of 37signals and why they believe it's essential for every employee to be a skilled writer, regardless of their title or role. Listen in as they walk us through the process they use to "Hire Great Writers" from their book, Rework . Join us to learn about the critical role that writing plays in collaboration, clarifying ideas, and unlocking solutions to the problems that have been keeping you stuck. Plus, discover how the developers at Basecamp and Hey are using writing to showcase their skills and share the solutions to their challenges. Show Notes: [00:37] - Jason shares why the cover letter is the most crucial aspect of the hiring process at 37signals. [01:34] - David shares how writing works to both set the tone for collaboration and as a 'magic filter' for eliminating BS. [02:26] - The personal scrutiny filter to use before you bother other people. [03:14] - The key to unlocking a stuck situation. [04:18] - The magic of writing and a few of the by-products. [05:17] - Meetings are toxic; why writing is a better way to do the bulk of collaboration. [06:23] - Why 37signals asks you to "show your work" during the hiring process. [07:53] - Why it's a good idea to "treat code as prose." [08:39] - No jargon required: designers and programmers need to be able to speak a shared language for a successful collaboration. [09:30] - For more behind-the-scenes, check out the technical blog at Dev.37signals , where the people who build Basecamp and Hey share about their work, the problems they've run into, and provide insight into how they've solved them. Links and Resources: The 37signals Dev Blog Rework Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email us HEY World | HEY Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast @reworkpodcast on Twitter
S2 E51 · Wed, February 08, 2023
Hire Managers of One
"Everyone should manage themselves" has been a core principle at 37signals from day one and has continued to be key as the company has expanded. Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down to discuss why it’s essential to the success of your company to bring on board self-sufficient employees who require minimal supervision in what they refer to as "Managers of One" from their book, Rework . Listen in as they provide tips on identifying such individuals during the hiring process, using Basecamp's features to replace what managers do, and the fundamental characteristics of a great "Manager of One." Show Notes: [00:42] - "Everyone should manage themselves": A 37signals mantra from day one. [02:12] - Establishing a culture where there is no need for managers. [04:03] - David shares two examples of how using Basecamp's Automated Check-ins helps replace what managers do. [05:12] - Jason shares the behind-the-scenes of using the work to find the employees who are "Managers of One." [07:26] - David shares how "Drive" by Daniel Pink highlights the three drivers of motivation that they look for in an applicant's cover letter. [09:20] - Hiring is not a foolproof process—for anyone—even Google. [10:59] - The "Manager of One" concept applies before and after the hiring process. [13:47] - Self-identifying problems and rushing to solutions are not enough; the interactions must also be great. [14:32] - The ultimate quality of a true "Manager of One." [15:47] - Not to dictate but to support: the hallmarks of a great manager at 37signals. [19:02] - We're getting ready for a "ask me anything" episode. Do you have a question for Jason and David or anyone at 37signals? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, or send us an email , and we might answer it. Links and Resources: Drive Rework Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 or email us .
S2 E50 · Wed, February 01, 2023
What’s in a Name
37signals has undergone some name changes since its inception over 20 years ago: starting as 37signals in 1999, then changing to Basecamp in 2014, before switching back to 37signals in 2022. Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down to uncover the story behind the name 37signals, the reasoning behind the name changes, and the impact a name has on a business as we discuss what's in a name. Show Notes: [00:46] - Jason connects extraterrestrial intelligence to the name 37signals. [01:56] - The out-of-the-park success that prompted a reassessment of the company's diversification. [04:07] - Do we really need all this? The stress (and necessary decisions) that grew out of success. [05:54] - How pride in their work led Jason and David to downsize their product line. [07:56] - Jason shares the behind-the-scenes story of the 2014 meeting that led to sun-setting their other products to focus on Basecamp (which is still in operation after 19 years). [10:04] - David shares the lightbulb moment he had during that meeting that prompted him to fully commit to changing the company's name and business model. [12:46] - Too many products, not enough progress. Getting everyone on the same page and figuring out the next steps. [14:27] - Same people, same location, NEW NAME (and domain). [17:16] - The difficult decision to stop running Highrise. [19:19] - Back to our roots in 2022. [21:37] - How having a unified brand name helps maintain a consistent tone and strengthens brand value. [23:15] - No need for a lengthy cost-benefit analysis—go with your gut. [24:18] - It's what we want to do, and that's enough. [25:03] - Two products under one umbrella, why returning to a multi-product company name made sense from a company standpoint. [25:37] - A brand by any other name—how much does your business name matter? [27:34] - Do you have a question for Jason and David or anyone at 37signals? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer it on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 HEY World | HEY Dev.37signals Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog @reworkpodcast on Twitter @37signals on Twitter
S2 E49 · Wed, January 25, 2023
8's Enough, 40's Plenty
Are you working over 40 hours a week while putting your personal life on hold? That's a common trap entrepreneurs, and executives often fall into while striving for success in their careers. It's also the fast track to sabotage your performance and drive yourself into burnout. It's time to re-evaluate your priorities and find a healthier balance. Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson sit down to discuss why "8’s Enough, 40's Plenty" from their book, It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work . Listen in as they walk us through how shutting down the laptop and disconnecting from work at the end of the day can actually help you prioritize your time. Discover how incorporating an 8-8-8 formula and pursuing passions outside of the office will enhance your overall well being and boost your productivity and performance on the job. Show Notes: [00:48] - Jason shares the tech problem of scope that leads to employee burnout. [02:09] - David shares the American habit of working excessive hours, regardless of the impact on work quality. [04:07] - The never-ending entrepreneurial competition to see who can work the most hours. [06:12] - Taking a stand against the chew 'em up and spit 'em out "we're at war" mentality in the tech industry. [07:09] - You can have success, health, and family, just not all three; pick your two. Why we need to reexamine what being a successful entrepreneur means. [10:15] - The simple 8-8-8 formula for a balanced life and a better performance at work. [12:07] - David shares how setting a specific time to disconnect from work can help you prioritize your time. [14:05] - 1 less hour of sleep=20% less cognitive function. [16:00] - The role of sleep in maximizing long-term productivity. [19:07] - The fastest drivers are those with the slowest hands, just like a calm (well-rested) company is the most productive. [20:27] - Kimberly reveals her strategy to break her workaholic habits. [21:50] - Setting boundaries with your clients can foster more realistic expectations and trust. [22:59] - How to help your employees adopt a 40-hour work week. [25:26] - Do you have a question for Jason and David or anyone at 37signals? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer it on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work | Books by 37signals HEY World | HEY Dev.37signals
S2 E48 · Wed, January 18, 2023
Pick A Fight
If you follow Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, anywhere online, you know they aren’t afraid to speak their minds and stand up for what they believe in. Today, Jason and David sit down to discuss how embracing their viewpoint has led them to go toe-to-toe with some of the industry's biggest behemoths. They’ll walk us through some of their biggest battles and what it took to stand their ground while positively impacting the world. They’ll also share tips for when, and how, picking a fight with a competitor can work to your advantage. Plus, more insight from the chapter called "Pick A Fight" in their book, Rework . Show Notes: [00:41] - Jason shares the reasoning behind their tendency to take a stand online. [01:27] - Broken business models: the awkwardness of companies who statistically lose money trying to sell business software. [02:49] - David describes how having strong principles and standing firmly behind them puts you in direct competition with companies that run on polar opposite business principles. [04:01] - Using the underdog advantage in your marketing = highlighting the things that resonate with the target audience you are trying to reach (and make you look good). [05:43] - Don't be afraid of picking on goliath-sized competitors, but be sure you are punching up. [07:02] - Be careful of coming off as crass. If you're the market leader, ensure you act like it. [08:13] - The story of the industry heavyweight that considered taking a run at squashing Basecamp. [09:21] - The big conflict with Apple and the resulting “rocket to the moon” free marketing [12:03] - Jason explains the difference between ignoring your competition and picking a fight with them. [12:43] - Be aware (but not too aware) so you don't compete in a field you'll never win in as a small business. [13:28] - David explains why having confidence in your unique and creative ideas can give small companies a significant strategic advantage. [15:07] - It’s important to remember a company's public image is just a sliver of its reality; follow accordingly and stick with being original. [17:42] - Why you need to keep your "pick a fight" campaigns organic, and NOT strategic, to keep them from appearing contrived. [21:25] - How knowing who you are and what you stand for as a company helps you handle the detractors. [23:15] - Picking a fight needs courage and humanity; injecting your principles into your marketing isn’t for the faint of heart. [25:31] - Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer your question on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-6
S2 E47 · Wed, January 11, 2023
Tales from the Front Lines
“When dealing with customers, especially those that are angry, there are always two tokens on the table. One is the token for it just doesn't matter. It's not a big deal. And the other token is it's the end of the world. We pick one, and the customer picks the other.”—Chase Clemons Today, Chase Clemons is here. Chase is the Head of Customer Support and is on the front lines every day as he leads the 18-person support team at 37signals. Listen in as he shares why every customer interaction's outcome depends on which one of the two tokens the support team chooses, how to keep things Fisher Price easy for better customer understanding, and some of the strategies he has learned over his eleven years at 37signals for providing excellent customer service. Show Notes: [00:56] - Chase shares his story of providing customer support for 37signals for 11 years. [01:48] - The two industries Chase thinks everyone needs to work in at some point in their lives to be able to handle ANY situation that life or customers throw at you. [02:25] - Chase shares what went wrong when the 37signals support team tried to meet a 1-minute benchmark for responding to customers. [05:25] - What the customer support team learned when they dropped the time requirement. [05:54] - Chase shares an example of how they got off to a rocky start with a customer, but by offering real people PHONE support, they turned it into a WIN for the team and a new customer. [09:12] - Is it a BOT or not? [10:25] - Chase explains the meaning of 'stop the cap.' [10:50] - Humans are expensive but also friendly and can actually help other humans. [11:46] - 'Training the corporate out of them' and adopting the Basecamp voice for friendly, concise answers. [13:12] - How to explain things so they don't get lost in the translation. [14:34] - Why the philosophy of Basecamp products is to keep things Fisher-Price easy. [15:17] - Chase compares customer service mistakes to white river rafting and why everyone is afraid until they 'flip in the raft.' [16:54] - The disconnect between what we convey through our text, how people receive it, and why the subsequent response matters the most. [18:01] - Chase shares the lesson of the two tokens when dealing with customers and why the support team needs to make a big deal out of the problem, so the customer doesn't have to. [20:07] - Chase shares his tips for putting everyone on the front lines , including where to start if you want to involve everyone in your company in customer support. [22:15] - "Interacting with the customers reminds us of who is paying our paychecks." [22:51] - The value of having an 'emergency' contact page for your customers to make them customers for life. [25:39] - Want some advice
S2 E46 · Wed, January 04, 2023
Put Everyone on the Front Lines
What is your method of connecting with your customers? Does your product or service make sense to them, and do you understand how they see it? Our perception of what is easy and straightforward and what the customer perceives as easy and straightforward can sometimes differ, making it vital for everyone on the team to hear directly from the customers without the ‘muffler.‘ Today, the cofounders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, discuss how 37signals gives everyone on the team an opportunity to engage with their customers from their book, Rework , in the chapter called "Put Everyone On The Front Lines." Show Notes: [00:40] - Jason shares why it's great to ensure everyone can engage with the company's customers. [01:47] - David shares why it's vital to hear from the customer without the muffler occasionally. [03:54] - Why it's crucial to have contact with the customers to remember you're selling to individuals—and it's rewarding, too. [05:31] - Ensuring everyone gets their chance on the front lines in front of the customers is one of the most important things you can do. [06:40] - Applying the productivity and insight enhancement process to your team. [07:35] - It's not wasted talent; it's a motivational, bright spot that pays for itself. [08:28] - If you think you're too good to help customers, you're in the wrong business. [10:40] - 'There's no way you can come away from this experience feeling like it was a waste of time. It's just it's impossible. It's actually incredibly enlightening.' [11:32] - Being on the front lines helps you remember that we are all human, facing our own things outside of what's going on with the software. [12:52] - Everyone means EVERYONE. Founders show up first and lead by example. [15:14] - David shares why sometimes your authentic voice DOES need to be filtered. [16:11] - Jason shares that you're in bad shape whenever you begin to recite the terms of service to a customer. [18:13] - Why customer support is really marketing. [19:56] - 600 new email threads daily, tens of thousands of potential ambassadors for your brand = the holy grail of organic growth. [21:25] - Customer live demos a thing of the future? [22:25] - Next week, 37signals' head of customer support will share tips on interacting positively with customers, even when they have problems. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 Rework HEY World | HEY Dev.37signals Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basec
S2 E45 · Wed, December 28, 2022
Year In Review: Growing As a Company
With the year ending, it's a good time to reflect on how far you've come in the past year as a company. Today, the cofounders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, discuss the growth of the company in 2022 and some of the significant changes they made this year. They'll walk us through some of the new positions they’ve added, the challenges they faced along the way, and how they work to preserve a culture at 37signals that aligns with who they are. Show Notes: [00:42] - Jason shares how their two hits, Basecamp and HEY , were the primary motivators to change the way they operate (and grow). [02:44] - How a bigger team is helping 37signals stay on track with their goals. [03:44] -David shares that after 20 years, the extra team members are helping to ensure everything gets done without over-scheduling and a little more downtime. [06:40] - The importance of expanding the team to be more available for their customers to help them better use the 37signals products. [08:13] - How they are creating educational tools to help their customers get more out of their products. [09:26] - Making the experience of buying Basecamp feel more luxurious. [11:13] - David discusses their painful experiences with not expanding their team to mitigate business risk. [13:04] - Jason shares what's tricky about new roles from the book, Rework . [14:01] - How to stop replaying your greatest hits and embrace the growth experience. [15:12] - How new blood and fresh perspectives help you test your old ideas to see if they've improved. [17:44] - The joys and challenges of letting go and leaning into growth. [19:01] - The frustrating and rewarding process of putting things on someone else's plate—even if YOU are good at them. [21:49] - The challenge of seeing beyond HOW the work is done to focus on the outcome. [22:54] - Why the culture at an 80-person company cannot be the same as the culture of a 40-person company, and what David and Jason are doing to ensure it remains true to who they are and what they stand for. [26:16] - If you have a specific question for Jason and David about a better way to work and run your business, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer it on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 Rework HEY World | HEY Basecamp Dev.37signals Sign Up
S2 E44 · Wed, December 21, 2022
Always Sound Like You
A small business has many benefits, like being able to move quickly, stay flexible and pivot when needed, something big businesses can't do as easily. But, with the lure of getting bigger, sometimes small businesses fall into the trap of getting caught up in stiff language and legalese and ending up not sounding like themselves. Today, the cofounders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, discuss why small businesses should embrace the fact they can communicate without running every word through a legal or public relations department, as discussed in the chapter "Sound Like You" of their book, Rework . Show Notes: [00:54] - Jason shares why they usually publish their writing directly — from mind to keyboard to the world—to get their ideas out there as clearly, and quickly as possible. [02:00] - Why running something you've written through a filter often produces something that sounds like legalese. [03:00] - David shares why writing what you want to read is vital (or don't share). [05:49] - Big company writing philosophy is often to ensure that your writing says as little as possible but reaches as many people as possible. It's why all big companies sound the same. [07:01] - David shares why you have to create your own interest by simply being interesting, by sharing something novel, of having a stand and a position on something in some regard that's also not just there. [07:52] - The smaller your company, the bigger risk you can (and should) take with your writing. [09:05] - Jason shares some dos (and don'ts) for writing for your small business. [12:12] - David explains why developing your writing voice is essential and how you can do it in relative obscurity if you are a small company. [14:49] - How to become an overnight writing sensation (after just ten years of practice). [15:38] - When you SHOULD go through legal and PR before publishing your writing. [18:35] - "We have expertise in authentically stating our observations and opinions about the business world, how to run a company, and how to develop good software—so that's what we do." [19:22] - "Everything is interesting if you peel back the layers far enough." [20:20] - Why it's essential to measure your writing for the internet as a body of work, not on a piece-by-piece basis. [22:03] - The unobtainable formula for creating a hit. [22:57] - The no-traction way to gain traction with your writing. [23:42] - Why you should avoid looking at the stats of how many people are reading your writing. [25:25] - If you have a specific question for Jason or David, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850, and we might answer it on an upcoming show. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and
S2 E43 · Wed, December 14, 2022
Let Your Customers Outgrow You
Customer relationships don't have to last forever. Keeping your hands wrapped around every customer will only lead to trying to evolve into something you're not is the death knell for your business. Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss the idea that you should let your customers outgrow you from their book, Rework . Show Notes: [00:32] - Why evolving as your customers do is a death knell for your business. [01:37] - David shares why, as a software design business owner, you need to be the voice of the people who aren't your customers—yet! [02:31] - By building in all the features your existing customers want, you are closing the door on what makes things turnkey for new customers. [03:24] - Not every customer relationship has to be forever. [04:55] - Jason shares why your product needs to evolve no matter your business size. [05:39] - Why it's important to gear your improvements on behalf of everyone and not a few outliers. [06:39] - How pricing models differ based on size - both of you and your customers. [07:49] - We don't have whales because we don't have the sales cycle to hunt whales. [10:38] - Keeping your hands clasped around every customer vs. knowing when to let them go (or grow). [11:46] - We don't want to change our business to support companies much bigger than ours, but your mileage may vary. [14:26] - The lackluster appeal of committee-driven software development. [16:07] - Hey —a different animal for a global audience. [16:31] - Jason shares why doing anything easy requires a lot of work. [18:13] - David shares why 37signals is in the business of designing software for an audience of one. [19:11] - Wallet-based feedback is the best feedback you can get. [20:03] - "The only kind of software that is out the gate great is software built for the people who've worked on it." [21:19] - We are putting together an "ask me anything" episode. So if you have a question for Jason and David, leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850. Links and Resources: Do you have a question for Jason and David? Leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850 Rework Hey Dev.37signals Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog @reworkpodcast on Twitter <a href='https://twitter.c
S2 E42 · Wed, December 07, 2022
Your Estimates Suck
"Getting out of estimates and getting into appetites and budgets is the single most important thing that we have instituted," - David Heinemeier Hansson Today, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the co-founders of 37signals, discuss their chapter in Rework on why estimating is not the road to completing projects and what has helped them get things done in their business for over twenty years. Show Notes: [00:42] - David shares why it's time to accept that we're awful at estimating. [03:27] - Why estimating is 'an amazing example of the human optimism to overcome its own fundamental flaws in a way that's just wholesomely unrealistic.' [04:48] - What 37signals does instead of estimating as relayed in Shape Up . [05:49] - Jason asks how much you are willing to spend (or lose) in gambling (and software development projects). [08:13] - The worst situation to be in for rational decision-making. [09:00] - Why it's vital to stick to your limits. [10:29] - "Getting out of estimates and getting into appetites and budgets is the single most important thing that we have instituted as a barrier for our software development process over all these years." [12:47] - In software development, no one—from the owner of the company to the end user—gets everything they want; staying within your parameters is about trading concessions. [14:15] - You need to keep the engine moving because software development is like baking bread on an industrial scale. [16:19] - You produce what you practice. [16:57] - You don't cut corners or quality, you cut scope, and if you can't, you scrap the project. [18:15] - Losing the right things prevents you from missing out on other opportunities. [19:48] - Forecasting the next ten years, six weeks at a time. [20:33] - Shortening planning cycles improves your ability to determine your next steps with more accurate information. [21:15] - 'We're making a ton of progress with a small team with a product that's been around for 18 years - so it works!' [23:21] - Why keep doing things that don't work? Links and Resources: Rework Shape Up Dev.37signals Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog @reworkp
S2 E41 · Wed, November 30, 2022
Come Small, Come All
There's a lot of talk in the tech world about getting bigger, growing as fast as you can, and getting investor money so you can scale quickly. But that's not the only path. And recently, we've seen that being bigger only sometimes works well for companies. Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the Co-founders of 37signals, discuss the bigger is better culture in tech and why the human connection inherently built into small businesses can actually be an advantage. Plus, their invitation to small businesses to think differently through their open letter called, Come small, come all . Show Notes: [00:44] - Jason shares why it's important to note that Basecamp is interested in helping the Fortune 5 million and the small shop down the street. [01:49] - David shares why it's important to him to be honest about the company's target audience. [03:29] - The key to finding the right dance partner that's your bread and butter. [05:30] - David shares the funny anecdote about when Twitter was a customer of Campfire and how they tried to "scare them away." [08:50] - "We found our space. Can we just stay here?" [09:59] - Jason shares why leaning into the space you are uniquely suited for and being closer to the work is an advantage. [12:08] - Why it's essential to cultivate confidence in the human connection built into small businesses. [13:36] - The unsustainable quest for a big market share. [15:10] - How starting out during the original .com boom and bust cycle taught Jason and David to make sure the company has margin times three. [18:28] - How to look like both an idiot and an oracle without changing a thing about the way you do business. [21:10] - Where business breakthroughs come from. [23:45] - How large companies devour innovation. [24:16] - A special offer to help make Basecamp affordable for new customers that sign up by December 31st. Links and Resources: Basecamp Open Letter to Small Businesses On Company Size Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com 37signals on YouTube The REWORK podcast The 37signals Dev Blog @reworkpodcast on Twitter @37signals on Twitter
S2 E40 · Wed, November 16, 2022
Out-Teach Your Competition
Throughout its tenure, 37signals has consistently grown without spending much on marketing. How'd the company do this? By out-teaching their competition. Recently, they've begun sharing their thoughts on company decisions and even doing product walkthroughs on their YouTube channel. Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the Co-founders of 37signals, discuss the true value of sharing the behind-the-scenes of how they work and what they've learned in over 20 years in business. Show Notes: [00:40] - The transparency in sharing the winding road of building your business. [01:17] - Why we share the behind-the-scenes of our work. [02:40] - David shares that the philosophy of out-teaching the competition is in their DNA. [03:04] - Building the company without overspending on advertising by sharing what we do through various mediums. [03:33] - Jason shares why the go big or go home tropes for building businesses fails to show all the options. [04:38] - How we built Basecamp . [05:25] - It doesn't have to be all or nothing: how sharing makes things more approachable for more people. [06:16] - The key to sharing what people need to hear when starting out. [07:13] - The value of practical and pragmatic lessons for small to medium-sized businesses. [09:01] - David shares why the lessons from mega companies might be detrimental to your company. [12:33] - Sharing the behind-the-scenes, how we work, and what we've learned in our over 20 years of business through our Discussing Decisions! Videos on YouTube . [13:49] - Why you won’t normally find the 'good stuff' in content marketing. [16:54] - Why Jason and David are not afraid of sharing their 'chef's' secrets. [18:21] - The "secret ingredient" lesson from Kung Fu Panda. [19:08] - Why most businesses succeed (or fail). [19:26] - The topics Jason and David don't feel are worth sharing. [21:32] - Jason shares why they don’t discuss revenue. [22:48] - Changing your lens of view to discover the value of the truth vs. a vanity metric. company. [23:41] - The immense value of sharing the 'true gold.' Links and Resources: Discussing Decisions! A Basecamp Pricing Experiment Discussing Decisions! Card Tables and To-Dos <a href='https://ba
S2 E39 · Thu, November 03, 2022
Company Meet-Up: Amsterdam Edition
Meetups offer remote companies an opportunity to gather away from the day-to-day for more in-depth conversations that foster deeper relationships for the team and bigger leaps for the company. At the beginning of October, sixty 37signals employees met up in Amsterdam for the first company-wide meetup outside the U.S. Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson, the Co-founders of 37signals, discuss the importance of in-person meetups for remote companies, the structure they use for their twice-yearly team gathering, and tips and insight for other companies on planning their own offsite meetings. Show Notes: [00:34] - The essential value of gathering the entire team together. [02:05] - Why the company decided to gather outside the U.S. for their latest meetup. [02:29] - The changing rhythm of a global company working across several time zones. [04:12] - How moving the event to Amsterdam turned it into a social experience. [04:51] - The priceless value of extravagant experiences and live connections to stay strong and connected as a remote company. [06:39] - Post COVID-19: Why the company-wide meetup experience is an expense not to be cut. [07:26] - How the scarcity of the experience adds to its value. [07:54] - The structure 37signals uses for their meetups. [09:41] - How getting together as a group fosters bigger, more crystallized discussions for bigger leaps as a company. [11:22] - From the intimacy of the small group dinners to the peer appreciation event, how the meetup fosters deeper relationships for the team. [13:33] - Unifying the unique human experience through sharing cultural diversity. [15:10] - The challenges of transporting such a large and diverse group to the meetup location. [15:52] - Introducing the Amsterdam meetup lessons into future events. [17:04] - Jason and David share their tips and advice for other remote companies looking to host their own company meetup. Links and Resources: The REWORK podcast @reworkpodcast on Twitter @37signals on Twitter Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com
S2 E38 · Thu, October 27, 2022
Decisions are Temporary
Co-founders of 37signals, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss decision making within an organization. Small businesses have the advantage of being nimble and able to change course quickly, so there's no reason to get caught up in the "what ifs." Show Notes: 0:47 – Avoiding overthinking and overcomplicating issues 1:47 – Getting rid of the "what ifs" 4:30 – Making decisions as small as possible 5:45 – The advantages small business have when it comes to being agile and nimble 8:30 – Getting comfortable with uncertainty 11:00 – Calculations and projections in decision making 13:50 – Deciding when to pivot on a decision 15:20 – The Tyranny of Metrics by Jerry Z. Muller 18:04 – The 37signals Guide to Making Decisions 19:05 – The 37signals Guide to Internal Communication 20:20 – Using instincts in decision making 22:01 – Maverick by Ricardo Semler 23:14 – 37signals upcoming technical blog Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com
S2 E37 · Fri, October 21, 2022
Leaving the Cloud
David Heinemeier Hansson, co-founder of 37signals, and Eron Nicholson, Director of Operations, discuss why 37signals is making the move away from the cloud. Show Notes: David's piece, Why We're Leaving the Cloud 0:59 - 37signals history with on-premise and cloud storage 8:26 - How cloud solutions don't necessary reduce operations teams costs 10:58 - What types of companies are the best fit for cloud solutions 14:14 - 37signals costs for cloud solutions and potential savings with on-premise options 15:25 - Advantages of working with on-premise storage companies that are similar in size to 37signals 20:08 - What the transition might look like, including timing 26:02 - Advice for medium-sized companies that might be thinking about making the switch Sign Up for 30-day FREE trial at Basecamp.com
S2 E36 · Tue, September 27, 2022
Don't be a Hero
You've been working on a thing for days, weeks, maybe months and you're still nowhere near finishing. Our natural instinct is to say, "I've already put this much time and energy into it, might as well finish." Well, most of the time this is wrong. You're not getting that time back either way and usually the better option is just to quit!
S2 E35 · Tue, September 20, 2022
Quick Wins
Building and maintaining momentum is one of the most underrated things you can do when building products. Keep moving forward by shipping work early and often. The longer something takes, the less likely it is you'll finish it. At 37signals, we work in six-week cycles, but even six weeks is a long time, so pepper in some easy, quick wins to keep that momentum going. Show Notes 01:23 - The Six Week Cycle (Basecamp 3 Help) 02:50 - Jason Zimdars 06:57 - Sean Mitchell 06:59 - 37signals.com 07:12 - basecamp.com 10:18 - There's no speed limit - Derek Sivers 12:28 - Goldilocks Zone (NASA) 18:14 - Setting the appetite (Shape Up)
S2 E34 · Tue, September 13, 2022
Good Enough is Fine
At 37signals, we tend to solve problems by finding a "judo solution." The simplest, easiest, cheapest solution that gets you 90% of the way there. It doesn't have to be perfect. It doesn't have to be great. It just has to be good enough. Part of this is reframing and simplifying the problem itself. And, remember, you can always turn "good enough" into "great" later. Show Notes 03:57 - Are Your Lights On?: How to Figure Out What the Problem Really Is - Donald C. Gause, Gerald M. Weinberg (Amazon) 05:26 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 08:47 - Team and project sizes (Shape Up) 09:31 - Principles of Shaping (Shape Up) 10:40 - Fat marker sketches (Shape Up) 11:32 - Just set it aside (HEY) 13:29 - Agile software development (Wikipedia) 15:56 - Kanban (Wikipedia) 20:34 - Shape Up
S2 E33 · Tue, September 06, 2022
Meetings are Toxic
Meetings are the worst type of interruption. A one-hour meeting with five people is actually five hours of productivity lost. They're also horrible at conveying information. So, why do so many companies jump to meetings as the first option. Next time try writing something up, jumping on a a one-on-one call, or just skip the whole thing altogether! Show Notes 00:37 - Why work doesn't happen at work - Jason Fried (TED) 10:56 - Digital Minimalism: Choosing a Focused Life in a Noisy World - Cal Newport (Bookshop.org) 17:19 - Multi-core processor (Wikipedia) 20:53 - Apple's spaceship HQ valued as one of the world's most expensive buildings (The Guardian) 21:09 - Free Fortnite (Epic Games) 21:28 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 21:29 - Work is like a hill (Shape Up) 22:53 - Successful projects begin with a great kickoff message (Basecamp) 22:53 - What's in a Heartbeat? - Jason Fried (HEY World)
S2 E32 · Tue, August 09, 2022
Bubble Up
A close look at how we develop features at 37signals. Designer Michelle Harjani walks Shaun through the entire process of making the Bubble Up Feature in HEY. Show Notes 00:42 - Michelle Harjani (Twitter) 00:59 - Bubble Up 01:28 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 01:38 - Set Aside 02:56 - Team and project sizes (Shape Up) 03:26 - Cool-down (Shape Up) 05:04 - Fat marker sketches (Shape Up) 05:32 - The Betting Table (Shape Up)
S2 E32 · Tue, June 28, 2022
Interruption is the Enemy of Productivity
Having a calendar peppered with meetings or other commitments is horrible for productivity. Most people need at least a few hours or even days of completely uninterrupted alone time in order to do their best work. On this episode Jason and David give some strategies for creating the empty space you need to be productive. Show Notes 14:56 - Slack 16:25 - Automatic Check-ins: Keep everyone in the know (Basecamp)
S2 E31 · Tue, June 21, 2022
Reasons to Quit
Are you doing work that matters or are you just doing what you think you should be doing? Sinking too much time into something that you should have quit working on weeks ago is an easy trap to fall into. Avoid it by asking yourself some simple questions: Why are you doing this? What problem are you solving? Is this actually useful? Are you adding value? Will this change behavior? Is there an easier way? What could you be doing instead? Is it really worth it? Show Notes 01:57 - Why are we likely to continue with an investment even if it would be rational to give it up? (The Decision Lab) 03:29 - Scope hammering (Shape Up) 10:01 - Live preview of "My Side" (@jasonfried on Twitter) 16:52 - Getting Real
S2 E30 · Tue, May 31, 2022
Illusions of Agreement
Simply describing your pitch can cause the illusion of agreement. Everyone may have a completely different idea of what you're talking about. Try sketching it out, hum the melody you want to create, or, better yet, start building the thing. Removing these levels of abstraction ensures everyone is on the same page. Show Notes 00:34 - Getting Real 02:31 - Agile software development (Wikipedia) 05:07 - Bubble Up 09:45 - Shaping the work (Shape Up) 13:46 - NEW: Refined Home Screen, Participation Types, and More 16:40 - Kanban (Wikipedia)
S2 E29 · Tue, May 24, 2022
Launch Now
If you had to launch your thing in just two weeks what would you cut out? Put off anything you don't absolutely need for launch. You can always build that stuff later when you have more information. It's best to just get it out there! Show Notes 05:06 - The Screener 07:22 - HEY World
S2 E28 · Tue, May 10, 2022
Sell Your By-products (Season 2)
Henry Ford turned wood scraps from Model T production into charcoal. That company is now called Kingsford and it's the leading manufacturer of charcoal in America. 37signals was a small web design firm before it started selling the project management tool it made to communicate with clients. That's now called Basecamp. No matter what you make, you're always making something else as well and there's probably a market for that too! Show Notes 00:30 - 37signals 01:04 - Basecamp 02:45 - Software as a service (Wikipedia) 04:41 - Defensive Design for the Web: How to Improve Error Messages, Help, Forms, and Other Crisis Points - Matthew Linderman, Jason Fried (Amazon) 05:25 - Getting Real 05:47 - Ta-da List 07:38 - Books by Basecamp 10:27 - Rework - Jason Fried, David Heinemeier Hansson (Bookshop.org) 10:48 - Shape Up - Ryan Singer 12:33 - Ruby on Rails 13:18 - Web Interface Design Tip: The Yellow Fade Technique (Signal vs Noise) 21:33 - Campfire
S2 E27 · Tue, May 03, 2022
Tone is in Your Fingers
Any photographer will tell you it doesn't really matter what camera you use if you know how to take a good picture. So often, businesses obsess over getting a fancy office, the best software or breakroom snacks, when they really should be focusing on getting customers and making money. It doesn't matter what gear you have as long as you know what you're doing. Show Notes 01:45 - Leica 02:42 - Malcom Gladwell Explains What Everyone Gets Wrong About His Famous '10,000 Hour Rule' (Business Insider) 02:59 - Start at the Epicenter (rework.fm) 04:04 - PHP 04:37 - Ruby 05:11 - TextMate 06:41 - Jason Fried (Hey World) 06:44 - I bought a sauna (Jason Fried - Hey World) 08:47 - Fuji Film 08:47 - Canon 09:12 - Barnes & Noble 12:31 - 37signals 19:45 - Maverick - Ricardo Semler (Amazon) 19:53 - Semco Style Institute 20:10 - Several Short Sentences about Writing - Verlyn Klinkenborg (Bookshop.org) 20:25 - Turn the Ship Around!: A True Story of Turning Followers Into Leaders - L. David Marquet (Bookshop.org) 21:27 - Are Your Lights On?: How to Figure Out What the Problem Really Is - Donald C. Gause, Gerald M. Weinberg (Amazon) 22:23 - The Manual: A Philosopher's Guide to Life - Epictetus (Bookshop.org)
S2 E26 · Tue, April 26, 2022
Focus on What Won't Change
A lot of companies focus on chasing hot trends or new technology. That's all fine and good, but the core of your business should be built around the things that people will always want. In the case of Basecamp, that means speed, simplicity, and great customer service. For a company like Amazon, it means focusing on fast delivery and easy returns. Customers are going to want these things now and 10 years from now. Show Notes 11:54 - Ruby on Rails 15:31 - Turbo 15:35 - Hotwire 20:04 - Automatic Check-ins 21:52 - "My Customers Would Have Asked For a Faster Horse" (Quote Investigator) 23:02 - The Tyranny of Metrics - Jerry Z. Muller (Bookshop.org)
S2 E25 · Tue, April 19, 2022
Throw Less at the Problem
When things aren't working, it's human nature to throw more at the problem. More money, more people, more time. However, this usually ends up making the problem bigger. So, do less! Reframe the problem in such a way that it can be solved with fewer people, less money, and without endlessly pushing back deadlines. Show Notes 00:50 - The path to Basecamp 4 (HEY World - Jason Fried) 03:09 - 10x Developer (Techopedia) 06:52 - Tesla 11:02 - Blue Ocean Strategy - W. Chan Kim and Renée a. Mauborgne (Bookshop.org) 13:49 - Setting the appetite (Shape Up)
S2 E24 · Tue, April 05, 2022
Be a Curator
Everyone has more ideas than they can realistically fit in a product. A good museum doesn't just throw everything in its collection up on the walls. There's a curation process. Someone says, "no." It's in making these edits that the real product comes out, so embrace it! Show Notes 02:32 - Shape Up 02:37 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 07:36 - Stick it to an email (HEY) 10:41 - Big Design Up Front (Wikipedia) 11:27 - Ruby on Rails 14:48 - Gantt chart (Wikipedia) 17:17 - Highrise 17:52 - Know Your Team 20:03 - We Work Remotely 20:32 - Sortfolio
S2 E23 · Tue, March 29, 2022
Meetups and Miami
Basecamp was in Miami last week. I sat down with Jason and David to talk about why we were there, the importance of meeting colleagues in person, and investing in culture.
S2 E23 · Tue, March 15, 2022
Making the Call is Making Progress
It's so easy to punt on something; to say, "let's wait until we have enough information to make the perfect decision." Perfect decisions don't exist, putting things off makes them pile up, and you'll end up getting absolutely nowhere. Very few decisions are set in stone. So, make calls as quickly as possible. Don't wait around for the perfect answer. Show Notes 06:33 - Disagree and commit (Wikipedia) 07:37 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 15:13 - HEY World 18:19 - Performance indicator (Wikipedia) 18:29 - The Tyranny of Metrics - Jerry Z. Muller 19:14 - Notes from Underground - Fyodor Dostoevsky 20:41 - Gary Vaynerchuk 20:51 - What's the ROI of your mother (garyvaynerchuk.com)
S2 E22 · Tue, March 08, 2022
Ignore the Details Early On
It's incredibly easy to focus too much on the little details of what you're building. You can spend hours and hours on something that will rarely ship with the final product. And, details are important! But, early on is not the time to worry about them. Focus on the basics first and worry about the specifics later. Show Notes 02:14 - Hill Charts (Basecamp) 03:02 - Fat marker sketches (Shape Up) 07:17 - On the Origin of the iPhone (Daring Fireball) 10:21 - "Getting Real" design tip: Just say no to Lorem Ipsum (Signal vs Noise) 12:15 - Why are we likely to continue with an investment even if it would be rational to give it up? (The Decision Lab) 12:16 - Why do we value items more if they belong to us? (The Decision Lab) 13:12 - Test-driven development (Wikipedia) 18:31 - basecamp.com/customers
S2 E21 · Tue, March 01, 2022
Start at the Epicenter
When starting something new, you can work on the stuff you could do, the stuff you want to do, and the stuff you have to do. It's the stuff you have to do is where you should begin. To find that epicenter ask yourself, "if I took this one thing away, would what I'm selling still exist." Show Notes 06:07 - Highrise 08:23 - Salesforce 15:32 - Is Your Product a 'Vitamin' or 'Painkiller?' - Entrepreneur 16:12 - The Screener
S2 E20 · Tue, February 22, 2022
Build Half a Product, Not a Half-Assed Product
You can't do everything you want to do and do it well. You just don't have the time, resources, people, etc., so you're going to have to cut some things. But, this isn't a bad thing at all! As with any other early constraints, embrace the editing process. Your product will be better off for it! Show Notes 02:08 - tilted 05:56 - Jonas Downey 06:31 - Ryan Singer 06:33 - Matthew Linderman (Matt Ruby) 08:49 - The HEY Cover Art Gallery 10:50 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 15:28 - A Review Of The Minimum Viable Product Approach (Forbes) 17:09 - HEY Features 17:23 - The Screener 19:04 - Getting Real (YouTube) 21:13 - The "Building of Basecamp" Workshop (37signals)
S2 E19 · Tue, February 15, 2022
Embrace Constraints
When you're just starting off you're going to be surrounded by constraints. You probably won't have enough time to do everything you want to do. You probably don't have enough people or money either. Don't worry! These are good things! It's when you're boxed in that you're forced to make tough decisions on what to do and what not to do. This results in a clearer, more streamlined product. Embrace those constraints! Show Notes 04:06 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 08:23 - Ruby on Rails 11:09 - SharePoint 11:12 - Microsoft Project 12:55 - Backpack 12:57 - Campfire 13:00 - Highrise 16:31 - Duke Nukem Forever (Wikipedia) 17:00 - Doom (Wikipedia) 18:24 - Shape Up
S2 E18 · Tue, February 08, 2022
Less Mass
Businesses can get weighed down by things like excess staff, countless meetings, long-term contracts, etc. The more mass they take on the harder it is change direction. Being able to change direction, to change your mind, is essential to building a successful company. Show Notes 07:20 - Newton's laws of motion (Wikipedia) 20:34 - Turn the Ship Around!: A True Story of Turning Followers Into Leaders - L. David Marquet (Bookshop.org) 21:35 - Hire managers of one (Signal v. Noise)
S2 E17 · Tue, February 01, 2022
Building to Flip is Building to Flop
A lot of people start businesses with the hope that they'll be able to sell it quickly for a huge pile of money. While this might happen sometimes, it's extremely rare and even worse, the businesses created with this goal sacrifice so much just for the chance to sell. They sacrifice their customers, their employees, their product quality... You get the idea. It's like building a house that only looks good in pictures, but you certainly wouldn't want to live in it. Show Notes 03:10 - The Imbox: It's not a typo 17:38 - Basecamp 3 Uptime 22:04 - Mojito island is a mirage (Signal v. Noise) 23:21 - Why 37signals Refocused on a Single Product: Basecamp (Inc.) 23:49 - Groundhog Day (IMDb) 25:52 - Finding Flow: The Psychology of Engagement with Everyday Life - Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi (Bookshop.org)
S2 E16 · Tue, December 21, 2021
Start a Business, Not a Startup
Last episode of the year and we're talking about startups. The new dry cleaner down the street doesn't call itself a startup. The pizza place on the corner doesn't call itself a startup. They're new businesses, that's all! So, what's so special about your tech company that you need a fancy word for it? Startups make you think of unlimited growth, huge investments, no expenses to worry about. This mindset can be unhealthy and detrimental to your new business. Show Notes 02:57 - Request for Proposal (Investopedia) 10:02 - Greater fool theory (Wikipedia) 15:57 - R.I.P. Good Times (Sequoia Capital) 23:00 - Hotwire
S2 E15 · Tue, December 14, 2021
You Need Less Than You Think (Season 2)
Before you start your great new business you'll NEED to hire some people, raise some money, rent an office, buy some ads, etc. etc. OF COURSE YOU DON'T. These are all just the trappings entrepreneurs tell themselves they need, when in reality, all you need is to start making something. Show Notes 00:03 - Budweiser Wassup Commercial (YouTube) 01:28 - Dungeons & Dragons 05:34 - Coudal Partners 07:36 - Minimum Viable Product (Wikipedia) 09:00 - Gumroad 09:03 - Stripe 09:22 - Squarespace 09:24 - Mailchimp 17:33 - Basecamp Merch 23:07 - Fingerspitzengefühl (Wikipedia)
S2 E14 · Tue, December 07, 2021
Outside Money is Plan Z
Taking outside money to start your business may seem like a good idea, but there are a ton of strings attached... You give up control. Cashing out becomes the #1 priority. It's addictive. It's usually a bad deal. Customers become less important than investors... You get the idea. Outside money should never be plan A. Show Notes 03:15 - How WhatsApp Makes Money (Investopedia) 13:28 - 37signals changing name to Basecamp, shedding products (Chicago Tribune) 22:40 - The deal Jeff Bezos got on Basecamp (Signal v. Noise)
S2 E13 · Tue, November 30, 2021
Mission Statement Impossible
Last episode we discussed how important it is to stand for something and you'd think writing your values down in a mission statement would be a great way to let people know exactly what you stand for. Well, you'd be wrong. Mission statements are almost always vapid, boring, platitudes that end up saying nothing at all. Even worse, they often turn people away entirely! Show Notes 00:11 - Lex Fridman (YouTube) 02:38 - The Soup Nazi - Seinfeld (Wikipedia) 04:18 - 37signals manifesto 05:08 - 1981 FedEx commercial (YouTube) 05:17 - About Us (FedEx) 05:45 - Values (Basecamp Employee Handbook) 10:04 - Elevator pitch (Wikipedia) 12:17 - About Us (Enterprise) 15:41 - Nudge Nudge Wink Wink - Monty Python (YouTube) 19:56 - What's the point of a Reservation - Seinfeld (YouTube)
S2 E12 · Tue, November 23, 2021
Draw a Line in the Sand
Whenever you start something, especially a business it's important to know why you're doing what you're doing. Having strong opinions, standing for something, can help tremendously when it comes to making crucial decisions and creating super-fans. Show Notes 03:27 - Embrace Constraints (Getting Real) 04:09 - Signal v. Noise 04:18 - It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work 04:44 - Signal v. Noise is closed. 08:24 - Citizens United v. FEC (Wikipedia) 09:31 - Oracle 11:07 - Pinkberry 11:35 - Pinkberry sold to Cold Stone owner (CNBC) 12:38 - Basecamp Launches (Signal v. Noise) 14:38 - r/faxmachines (reddit) 22:07 - Badass: Making Users Awesome - Kathy Sierra (Bookshop.org) 25:53 - Tesla Model S Plaid
S2 E11 · Tue, November 16, 2021
No Time is No Excuse
"There're just not enough hours in the day!" This is probably the most common excuse people give for not starting something. Well, guess what. There most definitely are a few hours you could probably squeeze in here and there. And, we're not saying you have to quit your day job to do it! Show Notes 02:10 - Fortnite 02:21 - Tetris Effect 07:57 - Set Boundaries (Shape Up) 09:37 - Jerry Maguire "Who's Coming With Me?" (YouTube) 15:13 - How Millennials Became The Burnout Generation - Anne Helen Peterson (BuzzFeed News) 19:40 - Gary Vaynerchuk 23:43 - Stripe
S2 E10 · Tue, November 09, 2021
Start Making Something (Season 2)
This week Jason and David discuss the essay titled "Start Making Something." It's only when you start building something the real insights come. Until then, all you have is just an idea. We also talk about Stanley Kubrick films and Jason introduces groundbreaking concepts like perforated pizza and "The Mysterious Cat." Show Notes 06:04 - Getting Real 17:22 - Collections 20:44 - Stanley Kubrick (IMDb) 20:57 - 2001: A Space Odyssey (IMDb) 21:10 - Music Box Theater 22:10 - The Shining (IMDb) 22:24 - The reason why Stephen King hated Stanley Kubrick film 'The Shining' (Far Out)
S2 E9 · Tue, November 02, 2021
Scratch Your Own Itch
Basecamp was originally designed as a way to manage 37signals' client work and its success can be credited to the fact that it was designed to scratch a very specific itch by the people with that were itching. Now, we're not saying that building something for others is necessarily a bad way to go about things, but building for your own needs has huge advantages. Show Notes 06:15 - "The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste. They have absolutely no taste. And I don't mean that in a small way, I mean that in a big way, in the sense that they don't think of original ideas, and they don't bring much culture into their products." - Steve Jobs in Triumph of the Nerds (PBS) 12:53 - Hotwire 13:57 - Not invented here (Wikipedia) 14:26 - Mary Kay Ash (Wikipedia) 18:12 - Second-system effect (Wikipedia) 21:35 - Minimum viable product (Wikipedia) 21:42 - Making sense of MVP - Henrik Kniberg 23:55 - The Homer (Simpsons Wiki)
S2 E8 · Tue, October 26, 2021
Make a Dent in the Universe
This week we discuss the importance of doing meaningful work. At least meaningful to you. What you do is your legacy, but that doesn't necessarily mean you have to change the world. You just need to be doing something that changes YOUR world. Show Notes 03:28 - Bullshit Jobs: A Theory - David Graeber (Bookshop.org) 04:37 - Drudge Report 04:38 - craigslist 05:01 - Flip Video (Wikipedia) 05:29 - iPod touch 07:46 - Rails 08:55 - Ta-da List 11:45 - Stoicism (Wikipedia) 13:47 - Aol. 16:44 - stripe 17:31 - Braintree 18:07 - shopify 19:01 - Paul Graham 19:36 - Viaweb (Wikipedia) 20:34 - Squarespace 21:21 - Stratechery
S2 E7 · Tue, October 19, 2021
Enough with "Entrepreneurs"
"Entrepreneur" sounds really fancy. Like a member of some exclusive club. But, what we're really talking about is just someone who starts something. Is it time to retire this word? Is there a better word to replace it? Can a business podcast go 30 minutes without talking about Steve Jobs, luxury cars, and watches? Show Notes 09:42 - Andon (Wikipedia) 11:23 - Nürburgring 24 Hours (Wikipedia) 17:14 - The E Myth Revisited - Micahael E. Gerber (Bookshop.org) 20:51 - Monolith Titan Conical Espresso Grinder 23:19 - Saddleback Leather 23:34 - How to Knock Off a Saddleback Leather Co. Briefcase (YouTube)
S2 E6 · Tue, October 12, 2021
Workaholism
Working long hours, putting in overtime, logging on on the weekends, have become badges of honor, but there's a big difference between work and getting stuff done. This week Jason and David push back against this idea of workaholism. Show Notes 01:37 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 02:46 - On Apple's monopoly power to destroy HEY (Signal v. Noise) 09:10 - Oura Ring 10:47 - Test-driven development (Wikipedia) 12:50 - An Inside Look at Google's Best Employee Perks (Inc.) 17:12 - Paid Time Off (Basecamp Employee Handbook) 24:19 - Summer Hours (Basecamp Employee Handbook)
S2 E5 · Tue, October 05, 2021
Why Grow?
Basecamp has always prided itself on staying small and lean. But, with two major products, we're going to change that. The question when looking to grow, however, is "why?" Show Notes 03:08 - Highrise 03:09 - Campfire 03:10 - Backpack 07:18 - Software as a service (SaaS) 09:41 - Slack: Getting Past Burnout, Busywork, and the Myth of Total Efficiency - Tom DeMarco 13:33 - Hill Charts 14:23 - Ryan Singer 17:52 - Citizen Kane 18:15 - "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell." - Edward Abbey
S2 E4 · Tue, September 28, 2021
Planning is Guessing (Season 2)
People put too much stock in making long-term plans, but let's call them what they really are: guesses. On this episode we discuss deadlines, business plans, world domination, and Dungeons & Dragons. Show Notes 01:06 - Dungeons & Dragons 01:20 - Mind Flayer 02:00 - Six-week cycles (Shape Up) 05:54 - The meaning of a bet (Shape Up) 07:23 - Shape Up 08:32 - Setting the appetite (Shape Up) 09:57 - "Plans are useless, but planning is indispensable." - Dwight D. Eisenhower 12:29 - Carlos Segura - Segura, Inc. 12:43 - S Corporations 15:24 - The deal Jeff Bezos got on Basecamp (Signal v. Noise) 16:51 - Blue Origin 19:04 - “The reason that most of us are unhappy most of the time is that we set our goals—not for the person we’re going to be when we reach them—we set our goals for the person we are when we set them.” - Jim Coudal quoting Dan Gilbert (Creative Mornings Chicago) 19:12 - Coudal Partners 19:12 - Field Notes 20:59 - Key Performance Indicator (KPI) 21:01 - Objectives and Key Results (OKR)
S2 E3 · Tue, September 21, 2021
Learning from Mistakes is Overrated
"Fail early and often." You hear this all the time in the tech start-up world. Failure has long been held up as a badge of honor for new start-ups. This week Jason and David take on this idea and make a pitch for learning from your successes instead of your mistakes. Show Notes 06:22 - Backpack 06:29 - Highrise 10:39 - Adobe Creative Cloud 12:27 - Campfire 12:31 - Slack 16:28 - HEY for Domains 18:16 - Work at Basecamp 20:33 - Hire good writers (Getting Real) 20:38 - Hire managers of one (Signal v. Noise) 23:09 - Microsoft Project 27:04 - Remote: Office Not Required
S2 E2 · Tue, September 14, 2021
Ignore the Real World
We continue our revisit of Rework with the essay, "Ignore the Real World." Topics include new ideas failing, risk avoidance, and Marvel movies. Show Notes 09:13 - HEY 16:49 - Black Widow 19:54 - Ruby on Rails
S2 E1 · Tue, September 07, 2021
The New Reality
In this episode we dive deep into the introduction and chapter 1 of Rework , The New Reality. Show Notes 02:09 - It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work 02:14 - Remote: Office Not Required 05:15 - Zoom 05:35 - rework@37signals.com 07:52 - JavaScript 11:18 - HEY 11:53 - Ruby on Rails 12:37 - Shopify 13:07 - GitHub 13:07 - Airbnb 13:08 - Twitch 18:05 - Stripe Atlas 18:37 - Squarespace 20:50 - Upwork 28:11 - FAANG 30:50 - Bookshop.org
S2 Enull · Tue, July 27, 2021
Before Basecamp
Rework is coming back for season 2 this September! In the meantime here's a little bonus to tide you over. Back in the late 90s and early 2000s, during the dot com bubble, Basecamp cofounders, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson both had run-ins with venture-backed tech startups. These experiences would form many of the ideas later published in Rework. Show Notes 03:27 - Leo Burnett 03:54 - Daily Rush 04:03 - 37signals 04:15 - Quokka (the animal) 04:54 - The Around Alone 11:38 - Basecamp 18:18 - Ernest Kim 18:18 - Carlos Segura 19:12 - Copenhagen Business School 19:40 - Competitive Strategy: Techniques for Analyzing Industries and Competitors by Michael Porter 21:34 - Bitcoin 21:34 - Ethereum 21:34 - NFT 22:34 - Skype 22:35 - Zendesk 22:39 - Ruby on Rails 24:24 - Ammon Haggerty 24:40 - Josh Ulm 24:59 - John Johnson 25:36 - An Oral History of Quokka, The Company That (Almost) Shook Up Sports - Sportico
Bonus · Tue, April 27, 2021
Going Dark
We are taking a pause with The Rework Podcast.
S1 E130 · Tue, April 20, 2021
You Had Me At Hylo
Tibet Sprague is a "communitarian technologist" with a vision for building companies and communities outside of investor-driven, for-profit systems. His current project is Hylo, an online platform for collaboration that's governed by its users. Show Notes "Truss the Process" and "Success is Surviving," our episodes on pay equity - 00:18 "Coops: The Next Generation" and "Exit to Community," our episodes about cooperatives - 00:21 Hylo - 00:29 Tibet Sprague on Twitter - 1:08 Terran Collective - 1:30 NRG acquired One Block Off the Grid (renamed Pure Energies Group) in 2014 - 4:10 Holo - 7:48 Announcement about Holo giving Hylo to Terran Collective - 9:08 Sociocracy for All - 17:30 "Mass vaccination site in Gary draws Chicago-area residents" (Chicago Tribune) - 24:32 "Gary, Indiana" from The Music Man - 24:42 Tibet's List of Resources Prosocial Reinventing Organizations Free, Fair, and Alive: The Insurgent Power of the Commons Emergent Strategy More books, articles, and resources can be found on Terran Collective's website .
S1 E129 · Tue, April 13, 2021
HEY, Is This App Accessible?
How Basecamp's Michael Berger approached accessibility during the development of HEY, including collaborating with a blind Basecamp user on accessible features that ultimately improved the experience for everyone. Show Notes Michael Berger on Twitter - 00:52 Web Content Accessibility Guidelines - 3:49 Apple's Voiceover - 5:32 JAWS - 5:39 NVDA - 5:41 Scott Ballard-Ridley on Twitter - 12:47 HEY for Work - 18:32 Ruby on Rails Core Team - 23:33 thoughtbot - 23:44 Aspiritech - 24:12 CSUN Assistive Technology Conference - 26:29 HEY's Accessibility page | Michael's write-up of his work on HEY - 29:51 Wailin's tweet complaining that Shaun doesn't insert enough airhorn - 30:10 Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 30:43 Manos: The Hands of HEY - 30:50
S1 E128 · Tue, April 06, 2021
Success is Surviving
When Robin Petravic and Cathy Bailey bought Heath Ceramics from the company's founders in 2003, they promised to keep the dinnerware maker and its manufacturing workforce in its home base of Sausalito, California. The pandemic provided an opportunity for Heath to recommit to this pledge and create a Living Wage Initiative, which in turn prompted a radical overhaul of the company's 401(k) program. Robin Petravic comes on Rework to talk about walking the walk on equity, resilience, and equipping Heath for the next 200 years. Robin and Cathy wrote about the Living Wage Initiative in Heath's January newsletter . Show Notes Heath Ceramics website | Instagram - 1:02 "Edith Heath: A Rebellion in Clay" (KCET, 2019) - 1:14 "A New Year, 166 New Owners" - 6:30 "Marin County's intensive effort drove down a COVID surge among Latino residents" (San Jose Mercury News) - 10:46 MIT Living Wage Calculator - 15:46 Eau de Space - 25:16
S1 E127 · Tue, March 30, 2021
From Insolvency to Upsolve
Upsolve makes a free tool that automates the process of filing for Chapter 7 personal bankruptcy. The organization is an atypical tech startup that's also an atypical non-profit. Co-founder and CTO Mark Hansen comes on the show to talk about how Upsolve alternately embraces and subverts the norms of the tech and non-profit worlds, and why the "right" corporate structure won't necessarily prevent an organization from causing harm. Show Notes Upsolve website | Twitter - 00:40 Mark Hansen on Twitter - 00:48 "HHS failed to heed many warnings that HealthCare.gov was in trouble" (Washington Post, February 2016) - 1:52 Rohan Pavuluri on Twitter - 2:28 Jonathan Petts on Twitter - 2:29 A 2014 study by the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau found that many payday loans trap borrowers in revolving debt - 3:45 Upsolve's explanation of a bankruptcy discharge - 5:37 Upsolve's explanation of the "meeting of creditors" - 8:17 The Legal Services Corporation's Technology Initiative Grant Program - 10:17 Philadelphia Legal Assistance - 10:22 Certified B Corporation - 10:32 Sidewalk Labs - 12:00 "YC-backed Upsolve is automating bankruptcy for everyone" (TechCrunch, January 2019) - 13:28 Yvon Chouinard's 2019 interview in Fast Company - 20:28
S1 E126 · Tue, March 23, 2021
Truss The Process
In 2016, software infrastructure consulting firm Truss made salaries transparent across the entire company. Salaries were revealed internally for all employees, from the executives on down. In this episode, Truss CEO Everett Harper and COO Jen Leech talk about why and how they approached their salary transparency project, and how they've adapted this system as the company has grown. For more details, check out Jen's write-ups of the project on the Truss company blog: "Why We Made Salary Transparent" and "How We Made Salaries Transparent." Show Notes Truss website | LinkedIn | GitHub | Twitter - 00:30 Everett Harper's bio | @everettharper | Jen Leech's bio | @jennifermleech - 1:20 Buffer's policy on open salaries - 3:27 "The True Story of the Gender Pay Gap," a 2016 Freakonomics Radio episode - 3:47 "Demystifying the Gender Pay Gap: Evidence from Glassdoor Salary Data" - 4:52 Dreyfus model of skill acquisition (Wikipedia) - 6:43
S1 E125 · Tue, March 16, 2021
Coops: The Next Generation
Imagine if gig workers like rideshare drivers or grocery shoppers were compensated for their labor through ownership stakes in the Lyfts and Instacarts of the world. Imagine if companies distributed profits not just to founders and investors, but to their employees and customers. Start.coop is an accelerator for startups that are doing just this—reimagining concepts like scale, investment, and governance under a cooperative ownership structure, and trying to create a more equitable economic system in the process. Show Notes Exit to Community - 00:13 Start.coop | Twitter | LinkedIn - 00:37 Greg Brodsky on Twitter | LinkedIn - 00:54 Greg's dad, Howard Brodsky - 1:25 Greg was on the board of directors of the Cooperative Development Institute , a nonprofit for coops - 1:38 Start.coop's graduates - 2:29 Jessica Mason on Twitter | LinkedIn - 2:54 40 Acre Cooperative - 5:31 The U.S. Federal Reserve says the typical white American family has 8x the wealth of the typical Black family - 6:50 Equitable Economy Fund - 7:20 Driver's Seat Cooperative - 11:11 Twitter discussion about imagining Apple as a coop - 12:56
S1 E124 · Tue, March 09, 2021
HEY World
Basecamp co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about HEY World, a new feature of the HEY email service where customers can create a super simple blog. HEY World has no templates, no endless scroll, no ads, no trackers, and no JavaScript. It represents Basecamp's attempt to create a Web 1.0 typewriter for our current digital age. In this episode, we talk about the return of blogging, countering abuse, and the sunsetting of Basecamp's long-running Signal v. Noise blog. Stay tuned until the end for a chance to win some Basecamp bucks! And by Basecamp bucks, we mean actual American dollars. Show Notes HEY - 00:17 Jason's post announcing HEY World - 00:22 Signal v. Noise - 00:34 The dumpster fire project - 2:02 Jason on HEY World - 3:10 David on HEY World - 3:13 "Pick A Fight (on Twitter)," a vintage episode about David's relationship with Twitter - 3:28 "100% Facebook-Free," our episode about getting Basecamp off Facebook and Instagram - 4:40 "Two Weeks," our episode about launching HEY and running afoul of Apple - 5:21 Berkshire Hathaway's website - 18:23 The.Ink , Anand Giridharadas' newsletter - 18:45 The Lefsetz Letter - 20:21 HEY's Screener - 27:20 HEY's Shield - 27:44 Basecamp's "Until the end of the Internet" policy - 30:56 Greymatter - 31:34 David and Jason talk about how they met via email in this episode - 31:58
S1 E123 · Tue, March 02, 2021
A Dose of Empathy
Equilibria, a company that makes CBD products for women, has a team of dedicated dosage specialists who do one-on-one consultations with customers. During the pandemic, this team has taken on an unprecedented amount of customer support—bearing witness to the heightened stress and anxiety that their customers are feeling around job security, caregiving, and family life. Equilibria's Marcy Capron Vermillion and Maia Reed come on Rework to talk about helping this team maintain their own stores of emotional energy. Show Notes "Women Tending to Their Basic Needs Is Not Self-Care" by Meredith Ethington - 00:12 "This Is A Primal Scream," the New York Times' special report on American mothers' mental health crisis - 1:02 Equilibria website | Instagram - 1:13 Marcy Capron-Vermillion - 2:20 Maia Reed - 3:39 Illinois Women in Cannabis - 4:25 Ellementa - 4:28 Laura van Dernoot Lipsky of The Trauma Stewardship Institute - 12:12
S1 E122 · Tue, February 23, 2021
The Humble Fungus
A career climbing the ladder in tech and software left Jesse Noller feeling disillusioned and isolated. He found connection, community, and purpose in a different kind of complex distributed system—mushrooms. Today he's the proprietor of a spore-to-table business called The Humble Fungus. (Content warning: This episode mentions suicide.) For free and confidential emotional support, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-8255. Show Notes Jesse Noller on Twitter | Instagram - 1:02 The Humble Fungus website | YouTube | Facebook - 1:10 Community Food Share in Louisville, CO - 3:32 The Humble Fungus "About Us" page - 14:12 The Humble Fungus on Patreon - 20:50
S1 E121 · Tue, February 16, 2021
Greening Basecamp
Basecamp recently set out to do a carbon accounting, looking at the company's emissions, as well as meaningful ways to offset and mitigate those impacts. Jane Yang and Elizabeth Gramm, the two Basecampers who took on this daunting and nuanced project, come on the show to discuss not just the work itself, but how they've been processing the fear, skepticism, grief, and hope that come with trying to address the climate crisis. Show Notes The United Nations 2018 special report on global warming of 1.5ºC (PDF) - 1:52 "Why Air Quality Matters," David Heinemeier Hansson's presentation to the company about indoor air quality - 2:26 The Uninhabitable Earth by David Wallace-Wells - 4:01 Explainer on Scope 1, 2, and 3 emissions - 5:46 Basecamp's former office in Chicago - 6:22 "Spending in the Clouds," our episode about looking for savings on Basecamp's cloud services - 6:59 Books by Basecamp - 10:18 "Towards carbon negativity," Jane's first post about the project on Signal v. Noise - 10:56 "Want to Do Something About Climate Change? Follow the Money" (NYT) - 13:05 "You Never Forget George Pappageorge," our episode about closing the Chicago office - 16:25 Microsoft's Sustainability Calculator for its cloud services - 17:59 "Basecamp has offset our cumulative emissions through 2019," Jane's follow-up post on SvN - 22:09 Cool Effect - 25:05 GoClimate - 25:06 ClimateAction.Tech - 26:08 Wholegrain Digital - 26:35 "The Chicago plant that sparked a hunger strike amid environmental racism claims" (The Guardian) - 27:04 350.org - 27:38 Elizabeth's Reading Recommendations A <a hr
S1 E120 · Tue, December 22, 2020
Send A Little Delight
Comfort and joy were in short supply this year, but we're doing our best to end 2020 on a cozy note. Merissa of Basecamp support talks about surprising customers with gifts throughout the year, whether it's to thank them for their fandom or apologize for a disappointing experience. Then Wailin shares a few items from her 2020 gift guide, and Joan of Basecamp customer support reviews a scented candle. Wishing all of our listeners a restful holiday season, and we'll see you in 2021! Show Notes Fabric in Flames - 00:35 love languages - 3:15 Basecamp merch store - 6:15 Elami - 10:42 Voluspa - 14:29 Packed With Purpose - 15:32 Gift Boss - 15:58 Greetabl - 16:15 Barefoot Dreams blankets - 17:13 Minky Couture blankets - 17:19 Oprah's Favorite Things - 17:35 Barefoot Dreams CozyChic Lite Circle Cardigan - 19:05 Glerups slippers - 19:28 Solo Stove - 20:06 Corksicle Classic stemless wine tumbler - 20:25 Parks Project x Rumpl sherpa blanket - 20:46 Spindrift subscription - 21:25 Mason Cash cane mixing bowls - 21:46 Neogen A-Clear Soothing Clear Spot Patch - 23:06 Ello Tidal 20-ounce Glass Tumbler with Lid - 23:58 Joan Stewart on Twitter - 24:35 Shaun reviewed the Boy Smells "Polyamberous" candle in our previous episode - 24:48 Kacey Musgraves "Slow Burn" collection - 25:53 IKEA's special edition candles - 26:18 "Amber" by 311</
S1 E119 · Tue, December 15, 2020
A Dumpster Fire of a Year
HEY launch, App Store, we can’t take it anymore Antitrust, masks a must, let’s go eat the upper crust Comfy pants, TikTok dance, POTUS rants, protest chants COVID cruise can't disembark, David's back in Denmark We didn’t start the fire—well, in this case we did. Show Notes Andy Didorosi on Twitter - 00:09 "Meet Andy," our episode about Andy joining Basecamp - 00:18 Signal v. Noise - 00:33 Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 1:36 HEY - 2:22 H.E.R.L. - 2:50 The dumpster fire livestream - 4:38 Detroit Bus Company - 5:59 Nathan on Twitter - 6:48 Raspberry Pi - 9:10 Recycle Here (Facebook) - 12:30 Ben Wolf of Ferrous Wolf Fabrication (Instagram) - 14:42 Monica Dubray - 14:51 Eric Froh (Instagram) - 14:53 Josh Bacon on Twitter - 15:03 "The Making of a Dumpster Fire" (SvN) - 25:31 Polyamberous candle from Boy Smells - 29:08 Kacey Musgraves collab with Boy Smells - 29:33
S1 E118 · Tue, December 08, 2020
HEY for Work
Basecamp is winding down a busy year with one more thing: the rollout of its HEY email service for the workplace. Co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about privacy, marketing, onboarding, and the other considerations that went into making HEY for Work. They also reflect on the roller coaster ride of the last year. Show Notes HEY - 00:41 HEY for Work - 00:46 Jason Fried on Twitter - 00:56 DHH on Twitter - 00:57 HEY's spy pixel blocker - 14:12 "The Spy Who Emailed Me," one of our episodes about tracking pixels - 14:35 "Two Weeks," our episode about the chaotic launch of HEY - 17:05 "Winston Sat At His Computer," one of our episodes about worker surveillance - 19:24 "Don't Promise" (Signal v. Noise) - 27:16 DHH did not write this copy about hygge for the Danish tourism board - 32:48
S1 E117 · Tue, December 01, 2020
Support and Console-ation
In the last several years, a group of Basecamp customer support representatives has developed an expertise around "on-call support," or tackling some of the thornier technical issues that require diving into the code base of our applications. This team of self-taught specialists grew out of curiosity, creativity, and an approach to programming that emphasizes fixing over building. Show Notes Basecamp's customer support team - 00:13 Jim Mackenzie on Twitter - 00:55 Jamis Buck on Twitter - 3:18 Jamis adapted his original Basil & Fabian on-call notes into a series that teaches newbies about algorithms and computer science. You can read Basil & Fabian on Jamis' website or on Kindle - 3:27 Dan Kim is now a programmer on Basecamp's Android team - 5:57 how to make templates in Basecamp 2 - 6:30 Wikipedia's explanation of traceroutes - 13:54 Kibana is another technical tool used at Basecamp - 14:55 our episode about holding office hours - 16:05 Rosa on Twitter - 16:07
S1 E116 · Tue, November 24, 2020
Shape Up with Clients
Since releasing Shape Up, the book by Basecamp's Ryan Singer about our approach to product development, we've heard from other companies who've also adopted this methodology. David Nichols is the co-founder and CEO of Loupe, a company that helps design machines for clients in sectors from aerospace to packaging. He comes on Rework to talk about using Shape Up principles with clients who come from a world of complex contracts and project overruns. Show Notes Our previous episode, "Shape Up: The Print Edition" - 00:11 Shape Up - 00:16 David Nichols on Twitter - 00:45 Loupe - 00:49 Six-week cycles - 7:56 Circuit breaker - 13:50 Loupe's explanation of how they "Ship in Six" - 17:30 Our episode introducing Shape Up - 24:52 We featured Hearth & Hammer on the episode "Bubble Wrap & Prayers" - 28:02
S1 E115 · Tue, November 17, 2020
Shape Up: The Print Edition
In 2019, Basecamp released Shape Up, a digital book by head of product strategy Ryan Singer about our approach to product development. Since then, Ryan has added sections in response to reader feedback and released a print edition. Ryan comes back on Rework to talk about connecting with other business owners using Shape Up, and how he approached the editing, design, and distribution of the physical book without going through traditional publishing channels. Show Notes Our episode introducing Shape Up - 00:10 Ryan Singer's Twitter | website | newsletter - 00:13 Shape Up: Stop Running in Circles and Ship Work that Matters - 00:16 Basecamp's other books - 00:43 Six-week cycles - 3:08 Setting the appetite - 3:36 Principles of shaping - 4:29 Hill charts - 5:20 What about bugs? - 9:48 HEY - 10:33 Making new products - 11:19 Basecamp merch store - 16:21 Notability - 16:57 Ryan's live sessions are on the Shape Up page - 17:24 Ryan's Shape Up Live session with Adam Wathan of Tailwind CSS - 19:34
S1 E114 · Tue, November 10, 2020
Take Some Time Off (We Mean It!)
Unlimited paid time off is a common perk in the tech industry, but as one company discovered, an open-ended vacation policy led to confusion and even burnout. Dan Jimenez of Chatbooks comes on Rework to talk about how they shifted from unlimited to mandatory PTO, and how they're recalibrating expectations for work, productivity, and rest during a turbulent time. Show Notes "How the 'Knives Out' Costume Designer Chose Chris Evans' Perfect Sweater" (The Hollywood Reporter) - 1:50 "27 Days in Tokyo Bay: What Happened on the Diamond Princess" (Wired) - 2:16 Wailin and Shaun discussed how they spent their sabbaticals in "The Bean Machine" - 2:51 Basecamp's PTO policy - 3:11 We addressed our PTO policy change in "It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work - Part 1" and "Rework Mailbag 1 - Part 2" - 3:25 Dan Jimenez on LinkedIn | Twitter - 3:42 Chatbooks - 3:45 Nate Quigley , CEO of Chatbooks - 5:49 Rachel Hofstetter , CMO at Chatbooks - 18:37 Dan Jimenez's Twitter thread about changing Chatbooks' PTO policy - 19:36 "What is Hygge?" - 23:35 John Wick - 24:18 Boy Smells - 24:35 literary candles from Hearth & Hammer - 24:39 We featured Hearth & Hammer on the episode "Bubble Wrap and Prayers" - 24:42 A24 x Joya film genre candles - 24:47 Bath & Body Works white pumpkin candle - 26:42 Shaun gets his togarashi from Third Street Market in Whitefish, Montana - 27:07
S1 E113 · Tue, November 03, 2020
Create Your Own Serendipity
More than ever, the tech industry is re-thinking how work gets done and how great ideas come to light when people are no longer linked by their physical location. In this episode, we have frank but hopeful conversations with Deldelp Medina of Black & Brown Founders and Michael Berhane of People Of Color In Tech. They talk about the ongoing work of building intentional communities in tech and modeling what it means to truly trust and support each other. Show Notes "Duty Calls," the famous XKCD comic - 00:18 "How Remote Work Could Destroy Silicon Valley" (Marker) — 00:40 "'Rich people leave, artists and queerdos return': is San Francisco's tech exodus real or a fantasy?" (The Guardian) - 1:09 Deldelp Medina on LinkedIn | Twitter - 2:07 Black & Brown Founders website | Twitter | Instagram - 2:10 History Channel article on the 1978 murders of San Francisco Mayor George Moscone and Supervisor Harvey Milk - 2:41 PBS article on Jim Jones and The Peoples Temple in Guyana - 2:46 Ruth Asawa - 5:15 BMUG (Berkeley Macintosh Users Group) - 6:34 Michael Berhane on LinkedIn | Twitter | Instagram - 11:26 POCIT (People Of Color In Tech) website | Twitter | Instagram - 11:29 POCIT newsletter - 17:39 Techish podcast - 17:50 Techish co-host Abadesi Osunsade - 17:58 The Lean Startup - 20:20 Aniyia Williams - 25:51
S1 E112 · Tue, October 27, 2020
Better Product with Adam Stoddard
Better Product is a podcast by Innovatemap , a digital product agency. We are playing their episode featuring Basecamp's marketing designer, Adam Stoddard, who joins them to talk about Basecamp's design philosophy and the thought process behind the look of HEY.com. Show Notes Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 1:04 Basecamp co-founder and CTO David Heinemeier Hansson discussed Superhuman in a previous Rework episode - 12:20 "Superhuman is Spying on You " by Mike Davidson - 13:23 HEY's pixel tracker blocking feature - 13:33
S1 E111 · Tue, October 20, 2020
Babies at Work
We talk to two very different small businesses about their Babies at Work programs, where new parents can have their infants with them at the office. With COVID sending so many office workers home—and pushing women out of the workforce altogether—acknowledging employees' whole selves is more important than ever. The companies in today's episode talk about how they've adapted their programs for a work-from-home-during-a-pandemic reality. Show Notes Leah Silber on Twitter - 00:05 Tilde - 00:58 Leah's 2017 essay, "Babies at Work: It's Weird that it's Weird" - 1:06 Our episode where Basecamp employees answered questions about working from home with kids - 2:36 "865,000 women left the workforce in September" (The 19th) - 2:48 “We’re just beginning to understand the extent of Covid-19’s feminist nightmare” (MSNBC) - 3:05 W.S. Badger Company - 3:43 Badger’s Babies at Work program - 4:09 "Parents Got More Time Off. Then the Backlash Started." (NYT) - 18:47 Parenting in the Workplace Institute - 24:03
S1 E110 · Tue, October 13, 2020
Privacy Scavenger Hunt
Imagine a corporate privacy policy on a website that was actually comprehensible and written by and for human beings. We talk to companies who have done just this, and what it means to build a business that has respect for privacy baked in from the outset. We also talk to a researcher who's witnessed the difficulty of navigating online privacy settings. Show Notes Mark Asquith's website | Twitter | Instagram - 00:21 Captivate.fm , part of Rebel Base Media - 00:28 Captivate’s privacy policy - 1:25 Hana Habib's website - 2:57 GDPR - 3:16 CCPA - 3:18 The study on privacy usability that Hana and her team published (PDF) - 3:46 Kaitlin Maud on Twitter | Instagram - 6:13 Rain or Shine Recruiting - 6:14 Rain or Shine Recruiting’s privacy policy - 11:50 Ryan Jones on Twitter - 13:16 Flighty - 13:18 Flighty’s privacy policy - 17:15 “A Hosty Retreat,” our episode about switching podcast hosts over privacy concerns -23:00 "Overcast's latest beta update tells listeners which podcasts are tracking them" (The Verge) - 23:06 Full Transparency Mode - 23:23 Transistor - 29:50
S1 E109 · Thu, October 08, 2020
Return to Mojito Island
We do a quick check-in with Basecamp CEO Jason Fried about what he's been up to since launching HEY in June. He talks about running the company as the pandemic stretches on, the importance of not making promises, and learning to swim. Show Notes "Greetings from Mojito Island," our check-in episode with DHH - 00:14 "Hey, What's Going On?" , our episode launching HEY - 00:43 HEY for Work - 2:47 “Don’t Promise” (Signal v. Noise) - 3:51 “Something’s Broken,” our episode on recent downtime - 4:58 Coalition for App Fairness - 12:43 Learn more about our conflict with Apple in our episode “Two Weeks” - 14:51 Vox explainer on Apple, Epic Games, and Fortnite - 15:19
S1 E108 · Tue, October 06, 2020
Greetings from Mojito Island
Basecamp co-founder and CTO David Heinemeier Hansson has been on a not-totally-intended sabbatical from both work and Twitter, and on an entirely intended break from living in the U.S. He checks in from Europe to talk about how he's managing his time off as the boss, and what developments back at Basecamp briefly pulled him back into work. Show Notes “Two Weeks,“ our episode about the launch of HEY - 5:00 Basecamp’s sabbatical policy - 5:23 HEY for Work - 8:23 HEY'S Paper Trail feature - 8:38 The School of Life - 9:27 It Doesn’t Have to be Crazy At Work by Jason Fried and DHH - 13:45 "Take A Break," our episode on sabbaticals - 15:05 “Something’s Broken,” our episode about recent outages - 15:58 "All Bugs are Not Created Equal" from Getting Real - 21:04
S1 E107 · Tue, September 29, 2020
Selling Burnout with Anne Helen Petersen
Culture writer Anne Helen Petersen, author of the new book Can’t Even: How Millennials Became the Burnout Generation , comes on the show to talk about how the real estate agents of the reality show Selling Sunset embody toxic ideas around work, passion, and career success. Along the way, Anne and Wailin discuss Christine's outfits, how they can't tell Brett and Jason apart, that $40 million listing, and more! Show Notes Anne Helen Petersen on Twitter - 0:39 Anne's newsletter, Culture Study - 0:43 The original BuzzFeed News piece, "How Millennials Became the Burnout Generation" - 0:47 Anne's book, Can’t Even: How Millennials Became the Burnout Generation - 0:52 Selling Sunset - 1:53 Wailin mentioned Selling Sunset in our episode "Apps Without Code" - 2:00 A BuzzFeed News profile of reality show producer Adam DiVello - 3:23 Laguna Beach: The Real Orange County - 3:25 The Hills - 3:28 Oppenheim Group - 3:42 Jason Oppenheim on Instagram | Brett Oppenheim on Instagram - 5:36 Mary Fitzgerald on Instagram - 7:04 Heather Rae Young on Instagram - 8:51 Amanza Smith on Instagram - 10:51 "How does the commission work on Selling Sunset?" - 12:55 Chrishell Stause on Instagram - 14:40 Davina Potratz on Instagram - 16:14 "Welcome to Airspace: How Silicon Valley helps spread the same sterile aesthetic across the world" (The Verge) - 24:02</p
S1 E106 · Tue, September 22, 2020
Something's Broken
Basecamp recently suffered three outages in a week. Programming lead Jeremy Daer and director of operations Troy Toman come on the show to discuss their approach to customer communication around these kinds of incidents. They talk about public accountability, mental health, and why the human side of incident response is just as critical as the technical details. (Read Jeremy's post and Troy's post on Signal v. Noise.) Show Notes Troy Toman on Twitter - 00:04 Basecamp's policy on summer hours - 00:15 Jeremy's Signal v. Noise post - 1:35 Troy's Signal v. Noise post - 1:38 Jeremy Daer on Twitter - 2:58 Basecamp's status page showing its uptime percentages - 3:55 The Big Integer incident was covered on Rework | in this Signal v. Noise post - 4:36
S1 E105 · Tue, September 15, 2020
Farewell, West Loop
Basecamp has closed its physical office after a 10-year run in Chicago's West Loop area. In this episode, we say good-bye to the neighborhood and two of its businesses. J.P. Graziano and un-cooked are small, family-owned restaurants on either side of the longevity spectrum: Jim Graziano is the fourth-generation owner of an Italian food importer-turned-sandwich shop, and Jeremy Jones opened his vegan grab-and-go place with his mother and wife in July. Jim and Jeremy talk about weathering the pandemic as independent restaurant owners. Show Notes Our previous episode about closing the Chicago office - 00:21 J.P. Graziano Grocery Company website | Instagram | Twitter - 2:15 un-cooked website | Instagram - 7:29 Collective Resource Compost - 12:27 Strength in the City | fundraising campaign for their mentorship program with SRV - 20:17 Taste Real Chicago - 34:03
S1 E104 · Tue, September 08, 2020
Exit to Community
A group of startup founders, investors, and thinkers are reimagining corporate ownership to take into account all of the people who help build the business—not just executives and investors, but customers, users, and suppliers. Their vision for Exit to Community is outlined in this zine , and two of its authors come on Rework to talk about their vision for a more equitable and inclusive end game for tech startups. Show Notes Zebras Unite website | Twitter - 1:18 "Exit to Community: A Community Primer" zine - 1:24 Mara Zepeda on Twitter | Mara's previous interview on Rework - 1:52 Hearken and Switchboard's merger - 1:56 Nathan Schneider's website | Nathan on Twitter - 2:11 Media Enterprise Design Lab - 2:17 "Meetup to the People: How a Zebra could Rise from a Unicorn's Fall" (Medium) - 4:41 "Meetup was a darling of the tech industry. But can it survive WeWork?" (NBC News) - 4:45 ESOP - 10:49 The #WeAreTwitter #Buy Twitter campaign - 20:17 Exit to Community peer learning cohort - 21:50
S1 E103 · Tue, September 01, 2020
Apps Without Code
We're back from our August hiatus! To kick things off, we have a conversation with Tara Reed , the CEO of Apps Without Code . She started an online art advising business without knowing how to code, and that early success led to an entire company and educational program that teaches others how to do the same. Tara talks about her career, the tools she uses, and why she hates the term "non-technical founder." Show Notes Selling Sunset on Netflix - 00:42 The Hills - 00:54 A BuzzFeed News profile of the reality show producer behind Selling Sunset and The Hills - 1:04 Columbo - 1:30 IMDb TV - 1:40 Wailin discusses her idea for an app to help you choose a streaming provider at the end of this episode - 1:56 Tara Reed on Twitter | LinkedIn - 2:36 Apps Without Code - 2:41 Google Offers - 4:06 "Sources: Groupon rejects Google's $5 billion offer" (story co-written by Wailin in the Chicago Tribune, 2010) - 4:10 Kollecto - 5:05 Strikingly - 6:57 Kollecto on Product Hunt - 8:02 Kollecto on BetaList - 8:03 SurveyGizmo - 9:40 500 Startups - 9:52 Bubble - 11:25 Zapier - 13:13 Tara's TEDx Detroit talk - 17:07 The apps Tara teaches are: Glide | Mighty Networks | Sharetribe | Thinkific | CloudMatch - 17:48 Spark AR - 21:05 Apps Without Code's free class | bootcamp - 24:36 <
S1 E101 · Tue, August 25, 2020
Rerun - Breaking the Black Box
Basecamp co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson sparked a national controversy this week when he posted a series of livid tweets about how his wife received a much lower credit limit than he did on their Apple Cards, despite applying with the same financial information. What began as a rant against opaque algorithms turned into a regulatory investigation and more. In this episode, Dr. Ruha Benjamin of Princeton University and entrepreneur Mara Zepeda, co-founder of the XXcelerate Fund and Zebras Unite, talk about how the tech and financial sectors perpetuate systemic inequalities and how to start repairing the damage—or building something more equitable and inclusive from the ground up.
S1 E102 · Tue, August 18, 2020
Rerun - Nevermore, Amazon
In the spring of 2019, Danny Caine, the owner of the Raven Book Store in Lawrence, Kansas, overheard a customer saying she could buy a new hardcover online for $15. Danny took to Twitter to explain the economics of independent bookstores and the thread went viral, putting the 32-year-old small business in the national spotlight. Danny comes on Rework to talk about why his activism and outspoken stance against Amazon haven’t just felt right, but been good for business too.
S1 E100 · Tue, August 11, 2020
Rerun - Mr. DHH Goes to Washington
Basecamp co-founder and Chief Technology Officer David Heinemeier Hansson has been ranting on Twitter about monopolistic practices in Big Tech for a while, and he recently got an unexpected opportunity to air his grievances about Google, Apple, and Facebook in front of a congressional subcommittee. In this episode, David debriefs on his experience and Basecamp’s data analyst, Jane Yang, talks about her work helping David prepare for his appearance.
S1 E99 · Tue, August 04, 2020
The Email That Changed My Life
Basecamp probably wouldn't exist today if not for an email that David Heinemeier Hansson sent Jason Fried in 2001. That correspondence was the beginning of a partnership that produced Basecamp, several books, and most recently HEY, the company's new email service. This episode is our love letter to email. Hear from David and Jason, as well as other artists, writers, and founders about the emails that changed their lives. Show Notes HEY - 00:11 Our episodes on how HEY was ... conceived - 00:15 ... designed - 00:16 ... branded - 00:17 ... launched - 00:18 Jason Fried on Twitter | DHH on Twitter - 1:06 The 37signals manifesto - 1:35 Signal v. Noise - 1:58 Saya Hillman on Twitter | Instagram - 4:53 Saya's company, Mac & Cheese Productions - 4:57 Rick Cosgrove - 8:50 Agency EA - 8:54 Samsung Developer Conference - 9:12 Julie Wernau on Twitter - 11:41 Mike McGee on Twitter - 16:26 AnitaB.org - 16:32 Neal Sáles-Griffin on Twitter - 16:37 Mike recounted the story of founding Code Academy (later renamed The Starter League) in a series on Medium. Here's Part 1 - 17:58 Nate Otto's website | Instagram - 20:13 Goose Island Born + Raised - 21:28 The mural Nate painted for one of Warby Parker's Chicago stores - 22:32 Liz Fosslien's website | the book she co-authored and illustrated, No Hard Feelings - 23:09 Our episode featuring Liz and her co-author, Mollie West Duffy - 23:13
S1 E98 · Tue, July 28, 2020
Two Weeks
Basecamp released its new email service, HEY, on June 15. It was supposed to be a calm, controlled product launch, but what followed was a period that CEO Jason Fried described as "chaotic, enthralling, (and) horrible." Basecamp got into a public fight with Apple over the HEY iOS app and the customer support team made emergency hires to help with an unprecedented caseload—all during a turbulent time for the world at large. This is the story of those two weeks, in the voices of the people who fixed bugs, answered customer emails, fended off security threats, and pulled off one of the most audacious undertakings in company history. Show Notes HEY - 00:30 David Heinemeier Hansson on Twitter - 00:50 Jason Fried on Twitter - 1:22 Kristin on Twitter - 3:21 Javan on Twitter - 3:53 Jason's HEY demo on YouTube - 4:21 HEY's desktop apps - 5:26 Dylan on Twitter - 7:09 Zach on Twitter - 8:37 David's "burn this house down" tweet - 12:03 Protocol's coverage of Apple's rejection - 14:21 Macintosh SE - 16:20 Conor on Twitter - 18:26 Signal v. Noise post written for Juneteenth - 19:34 Lexi on Twitter - 20:54 Jason Fried's open letter to Apple about IAP - 22:09 TechCrunch interview with Phil Schiller - 23:32 David's olive branch tweet - 24:51 HEY for Work - 28:51 Rosa on Twitter - 31:32 Jorge on Twitter - 31:58 Michael on Twitter - 32:33 Jonas on Twitter - 33:00 "Hire When It Hurts" and "Welcome Aboard" are our episodes about Basecamp's hiring and onboarding processes - 36:08 Jason Fried's letter, <a href='https://hey
S1 E97 · Tue, July 21, 2020
Q and HEY, Part 2
Basecamp co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson held a recent livestream session where they answered questions about HEY, the company's new email service. You can listen to Part 1 or watch the entire livestream on YouTube. Show Notes Q1: What's the timeframe on new features? - 00:38 HEY for Work - 00:50 Shape Up - 1:13 Apple vs. HEY - 4:33 It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy At Work - 6:07 Q2: How did you get HEY.com? - 7:12 "How we acquired HEY.com" (Signal v. Noise) - 7:30 Q3: When would you say you've taken on Gmail? - 9:53 Q4: What's the environmental impact of HEY? - 14:14 Data analyst Jane Yang's SvN post on carbon negativity - 15:45 Q5: It's been crazy at work for the last couple weeks. How do you get back to normal? - 15:52 Q6: Now that you have two products, are you concerned with context switching in the future? - 17:38 Q7: What's the problem with "inbox zero?" - 20:04 Q8: How could I possibly move to HEY with 16 years of emails in Gmail? - 24:10 HEY's guide for moving from Gmail - 24:10
S1 E96 · Tue, July 14, 2020
Q and HEY, Part 1
Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson held a livestream session where they answered audience questions about Hey, Basecamp's new email service. In Part One, they discuss feature requests, customer support, and plans for hiring. The full Q&A can be viewed on YouTube . Show Notes HEY.com - 00:10 Jason Fried on Twitter | DHH on Twitter - 00:24 Jason and David's remote work Q&A, Part 1 and Part 2 - 1:03 Q1: What's your suggestion for managing the Feed? - 1:29 Q2: What are you going to do about signatures? - 5:03 Q3: What's a feature you've gotten the most requests for that you won't bring to HEY? - 6:13 Q4: Who led UI/UX for HEY, and do you do any user research? - 8:48 Q5: What's the intended purpose of the Previously Seen section? - 9:57 Q6: Having support with actual humans for an email service seems unique. Are you planning to lean into that with your marketing? - 11:33 Q7: What's your vision for enterprise HEY adoption? - 13:49 Q8: What about accessibility? - 16:11 Q9: What about recruiting? - 16:45 Q10: Do you recycle email addresses after someone stops paying? - 20:05 Q11: Do you offer monthly subscriptions? - 22:35 Q12: Now that you've launched, is there anything you wish you would have done differently? - 26:07 @heyhey on Twitter - 31:50
S1 E95 · Tue, July 07, 2020
Manos: The Hands of Hey
Basecamp's marketing designer, Adam Stoddard, talks about how Hey's visual brand came to be. He discusses influences from Pixar to Charles and Ray Eames to The Raveonettes, and reflects on what it's like to work as a department of one on such an all-encompassing project. Show Notes Manos: The Hands of Fate - 00:04 Mystery Science Theater 3000 - 00:07 Our previous episode "Hey, What's Going On?" with Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson giving an overview of Hey - 00:35 Our previous episode "Designing Hey" with Jonas Downey - 00:38 Our previous episode "An Email Account Is Born" with Merissa Dawson, on creating a demo account - 00:40 Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 00:58 Hey.com - 1:08 "Screen emails like you screen calls" - 2:59 "How it works" - 4:25 Toy Story of Terror! - 8:42 Procreate app - 9:27 Charles and Ray Eames - 16:22 A 2003 article about The Raveonettes albums that are written with just three chords and in one key - 21:12
S1 E94 · Tue, June 30, 2020
An Email Account is Born
To show off the features of HEY, Basecamp's new email service, we needed a fully featured and realistic demo account. That meant writing dozens of fictional emails—a task that fell to Merissa of Basecamp's customer support team. She comes on Rework to talk about her epistolary opus. Show Notes HEY website | @heyhey on Twitter - 00:22 Team OMG - 1:39 Notes to self feature - 5:32 Clips feature - 5:35 Reply Later feature - 5:42 Screener feature - 5:51 Fitzgerald "Fitz" Grant - 9:13 "'A Star Is Born' and the Enduring Appeal of 'I Just Wanted to Take Another Look At You'" (Film School Rejects) - 9:29
S1 E93 · Tue, June 23, 2020
Designing Hey
Basecamp design lead Jonas Downey was one of the first people to experiment with what would eventually become Hey, Basecamp’s newly launched email service. Jonas comes on Rework to talk about building software for humans, preserving a sense of fun weirdness as a new product evolves, and managing a big launch during a tumultuous time. Show Notes Hey - 00:21 Our previous episode about Hey, featuring Basecamp co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson - 00:27 Apple vs. Hey - 00:40 Jonas Downey on Twitter - 00:56 Prairienet - 1:36 Basecamp’s book on a calm workplace - 19:20
S1 E92 · Tue, June 16, 2020
Hey, What's Going On?
Basecamp has launched Hey, a new email platform with a strong point of view. It's also one of the stupidest things Basecamp has ever attempted. Co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about the philosophy around time, attention, and privacy that forms the backbone of Hey, why Inbox Zero is a tyrannical scam, and what Hey does differently. Show Notes Hey.com | the Hey manifesto - 00:14 Jason Fried on Twitter - 00:34 DHH on Twitter - 00:48 Jason and Ryan Singer discussed Hey's origins in Highrise in this product strategy Q&A - 3:20 "Highrise is back with Basecamp" (Signal v. Noise) - 3:44 Our previous episode about pixel tracking - 20:04 Our previous episode talking about Superhuman - 24:01 Ian Malcolm's "Your scientists..." clip from Jurassic Park - 30:45
S1 E91 · Tue, June 09, 2020
The Spy Who Emailed Me
On June 15, Basecamp launches a new email service called Hey. One of its features is that it blocks tracking pixels that report back to the sender when and how you read an email. In this episode, Basecamp's marketing team talks about their difficult search for an email newsletter provider that doesn't track subscribers. And Nabiha Syed, president of the new investigative journalism outlet The Markup, talks about their commitment to data minimization—including zero tracking, not even open rates, on their newsletters—and how that affects their relationship with readers. Show Notes Basecamp’s newsletter - 2:34 Hey - 3:05 Andy Didorosi on Twitter - 3:29 Farnam Street newsletter - 5:47 Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 7:23 Mailchimp's postcard program | Opt out of receiving postcards - 9:21 Sendy.co - 12:34 Nabiha Syed's bio | Twitter - 14:04 The Markup - 14:06 The Markup's privacy policy - 14:28 Nabiha’s letter - 16:27 Martijn de Kuijper on Twitter | Revue - 18:40
S1 E90 · Tue, June 02, 2020
The Bookshop Around the Corner
Andy Hunter launched Bookshop.org in January as a platform to help independent bookstores take and fulfill online orders. Shortly afterward, the pandemic forced small businesses to close their physical doors and Bookshop.org found itself trying to manage three years of growth in three months. Andy comes on the show for a deep dive into how his business works, monopoly power in the book industry, and what steps Bookshop is taking to make sure growth and success don't compromise their mission. Show Notes Annihilation by Jeff VanderMeer - 1:27 " Nevermore, Amazon ," our episode about The Raven Book Store - 2:06 Andy Hunter on Twitter - 2:44 Bookshop website | Twitter | Instagram - 2:44 Catapult | Counterpoint | Soft Skull Press - 3:28 Lit Hub - 3:32 Ingram - 6:21 Certified B Corporation - 9:25 Politics and Prose Bookstore in Washington, D.C. - 10:18 Tattered Cover Book Store in Denver, CO - 10:19 Powell’s Books in Portland, OR - 10:20 IndieBound - 13:30 Morgan Entrekin - 15:34 HappyFunCorp - 18:36 Libro.fm - 19:37 Hummingbird Digital Media - 20:16 "Baker & Taylor to Drop Wholesale Book Distribution to Retailers" - 24:56 BuzzFeed article about GrubHub collecting fees from restaurants even when customers call to place orders - 26:05 Jitterbug Perfume by Tom Robbins - 30:23 Astounding by Alec Nevala-Lee (Wailin's husband) - 30:45
S1 E89 · Tue, May 26, 2020
Help Wanted
The pandemic has caused enormous job losses and forced many companies to rethink the nature of work. In this episode, two Stanford students talk about the online resource they built to help fellow students whose summer internships were canceled, and Wildbit CEO Natalie Nagele returns to Rework to discuss the launch of People-First Jobs , a job board that connects seekers with human-centered companies. Show Notes Akshaya Dinesh's website | LinkedIn | Twitter - 1:10 Andrew Tan's website | LinkedIn | Twitter - 1:28 Verkada - 3:36 LinkedIn post announcing the mentorship program - 5:36 Remote Students - 8:10 People-First Jobs website | Twitter - 10:17 Wildbit - 10:21 Natalie Nagele on Twitter - 10:30 COVID-19 Resources on People-First Jobs - 17:27 our recent episode about banning makers of employee surveillance technology - 18:53 Kitty Hawk - 20:20
S1 E88 · Tue, May 19, 2020
Winston Sat At His Computer
A growing number of companies have turned to employee surveillance software to monitor their newly remote workforce. Basecamp, which has taken a hardline stance against surveillance of all kinds, decided to ban makers of this "tattleware" from integrating with our products. Basecamp CTO David Heinemeier Hansson comes on the show to talk about how a special "Moral Quandaries" team at the company made the decision and how surveillance systems poison the future of remote work. Show Notes Awair air quality monitor - 00:34 A presentation by DHH on "Why Air Quality Matters" - 1:15 DHH on Twitter - 1:55 Basecamp Terms of Service -2:37 Until the End of the Internet policy - 2:46 Basecamp API - 3:54 basecamp.com/extras - 4:09 Article by Drew Harwell of the Washington Post about employee surveillance - 5:10 REMOTE: Office Not Required by Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson - 8:53 The surveillance illustration from REMOTE - 9:00 GitHub repository for Basecamp policies - 14:00 Signal v. Noise post about the new policy - 14:21 Apple's "1984" commercial for the Macintosh - 17:10
S1 E87 · Tue, May 12, 2020
Bubble Wrap & Prayers
The government may not consider comic book shops, indoor plant stores, and small boutiques "essential," but these businesses are vital to the unique fabric of their neighborhoods and downtowns. Without foot traffic, they're finding new ways to connect with customers and stay afloat, all while navigating supply chain disruptions and e-commerce logistics. Show Notes AlleyCat Comics website | Facebook | Instagram - 0:55 Mighty Con - 1:36 "New Comics Delayed Across Industry in Wake of Coronavirus Concerns" (The Hollywood Reporter) - 2:10 Our previous episodes about small businesses and COVID covered fitness studios and family-oriented businesses - 2:37 Hearth & Hammer General Store website | Facebook | Instagram - 3:29 Walden Woods candle - 4:22 The Zen Succulent website | Facebook | Instagram - 8:00 Modern Terrarium Studio by Megan George - 9:01 Jordan Grace Owens website | collaboration with The Zen Succulent - 10:36 Claire Daniel website | picture of her installation at The Zen Succulent - 11:02 Mad Cave Studios GoFundMe for comic book shops - 13:25 Image Comics announcement on their COVID measures - 13:37 Megan George was able to get a Paycheck Protection Program loan, but most of her fellow women of color business owners were shut out - 16:04 <a href='https://imagecomics.com/com
S1 E86 · Thu, May 07, 2020
Living on Hope
We call up our friend and former colleague Esther Lee, who lives with her husband on a 35-foot sailboat named Hope in Jacksonville, Florida. Esther, an "idealist in hiding," talks about how living smaller gives her more space to turn outward and care for others, especially now. Show Notes Esther's bio at the Poetry Foundation - 00:25 The Minimalists - 3:30 Sailrite sewing machines - 9:30 eXXpedition - 13:32 eXXpedition's João Pessoa to Barbados leg has been rescheduled to 2022 - 13:45 Sacrificial Metal by Esther Lee - 14:22 Rudolf Laban - 14:52 Wayfinders Now on Instagram | website - 17:55
S1 E85 · Tue, May 05, 2020
Kids Incorporated
Endless Zoom meetings, being cut off from friends, the widespread cancellation of summer fun, ricocheting between boredom and anxiety—kids have it pretty rough! And it's no picnic for their parents, either. In this episode, businesses built on offering in-person enrichment for children talk about how they're adapting to reach families and stay resilient during this time. Show Notes Nancy Mork's biography - 00:47 Fussy Baby Network website | Facebook - 00:50 Erikson Institute - 00:53 Hatch Art Studio website | Instagram - 3:51 Collage Workshop for Kids by Shannon Merenstein - 3:55 Omowale Casselle on Twitter - 5:28 Digital Adventures website - 5:32 Bar Rucci's Art Bar Blog - 13:06 Eric Carle Museum of Picture Book Art - 21:17 Eric Carle's book is The Very Hungry Caterpillar (not The Hungry Hungry Caterpillar like Wailin says) - 21:21 Collage Workshop for Kids on Bookshop.org - 21:29
S1 E84 · Thu, April 30, 2020
BONUS - Breadcamp
Basecampers Nathan Anderson and Joan Stewart talk about their love of baking bread and how to get started if you're a newbie. As Joan says, you just have to believe. Show Notes The New York Times chocolate chip cookie recipe , adapted from Jacques Torres - 00:43 Nathan Anderson on Twitter - 1:00 Nathan attended Artisan Bread Camp , taught by Tom Edwards . Read a Washington Post story about the reporter's experience at the same session (Nathan is briefly mentioned in the article and is in one of the photos.) - 2:00 Bon Appétit YouTube channel - 2:14 Joan Stewart on Twitter - 2:17 "Brad and Claire Make Sourdough Bread" - 2:35 Claire Saffitz on Instagram - 2:39 Bread magazine - 3:00 Recipes for using sourdough starter discard - 5:05 Edna Mode - 7:25
S1 E83 · Tue, April 28, 2020
Product Strategy Q&A with Jason Fried and Ryan Singer
CEO Jason Fried and Head of Strategy Ryan Singer talk about the Shape Up approach to product development that we use at Basecamp. They discuss organizing work in six-week cycles, how to handle disagreement, and how so much of the process boils down to making trade-offs. You can also watch the full video of this Q&A session . Show Notes Going Remote Q&A videos on YouTube - 00:57 Basecamp's remote work resources - 1:00 Jason Fried | Ryan Singer on Twitter - 1:09 Hey , Basecamp's forthcoming email product - 1:23 Shape Up: Stop Running in Circles and Ship Work that Matters - 2:17 Q1: How do you go about planning something from scratch? What are the different milestones in the product-planning process? - 4:59 An explainer of six-week cycles - 6:10 An explainer of finding the epicenter from Getting Real, Basecamp's earlier book on product development - 11:50 Q2: How do you decide how far to break down projects? Can you be so granular that you reach a point of diminishing returns? - 13:31 Shape Up chapter on scopes - 16:10 Q3: How do you decide which pitches to execute, and how often do you disagree? - 19:32 Spikeball - 27:55 Q4: How is potential value creation assessed in the betting process? - 27:58 Q5: How do you alert someone about work that needs to be done by them? - 34:45 Q6: How do you do a 6-week cycle for a whole new project? - 37:10 Inverted pyramid - 38:36 Q7: How do you pitch the Shape Up process to someone who’s not technical? - 39:28 Q8: How do you train team members to learn the work process? - 42:28 Q9: How do conversations with customers fit into the shaping and strategy? - 46:22 Q10: What do you do about people who ignore the breadboarding and fat marker techniques? - 50:33 Q11: Is there a utility in using software? - 54:49 Q12: When approaching features like two-factor authentication or encryption, how do you balance what’s most secure with what’s most convenient for users? - 55:22 Q12: H
S1 E82 · Thu, April 23, 2020
Going Remote: Kids at Home
Several of Basecamp's working parents talk about (not) getting things done with small children around, navigating responsibilities and feelings with partners, structuring the day, primal screaming, and more. You can also watch the full video replay of this Q&A session. Show Notes Going Remote series on YouTube - 00:10 Basecamp's Remote Resources page - 00:39 Question 1: If you’re home with kids under three, how do you work while they’re craving your attention? - 4:00 Going Remote episode about customer support - 6:25 Art for Kids Hub on YouTube - 15:31 Lunch Doodles with children's book author Mo Willems - 15:51 LeVar Burton does #LeVarBurtonReadsLive on his Twitter feed - 15:55 Question 2: How do you navigate tension between partners when one person bears more of the childcare responsibilities? - 19:22 Question 3: What morning habits do you have to keep yourself aligned? - 23:33 Basecamp on Twitter - 27:23
S1 E81 · Tue, April 21, 2020
The Soul of an Entrepreneur
David Sax is the author of the new book The Soul of an Entrepreneur: Work and Life Beyond the Startup Myth . He comes on the show to debunk the Silicon Valley narrative that only a rarefied subset of people can succeed as founders, and shares examples from his book of business owners whose complex relationship with freedom, risk, and success offer a fuller picture of entrepreneurship. Read David's recent op-ed in the New York Times, "The Coronavirus Is Showing Us Which Entrepreneurs Matter." Show Notes David Sax's website | Twitter - 1:16 The Soul of an Entrepreneur: Work and Life Beyond the Startup Myth - 1:21 "At 21, Kylie Jenner Becomes The Youngest Self-Made Billionaire Ever" (Forbes) - 7:05 A 2017 Daily Beast profile of Kris Jenner's mother - 7:21 ESOPs - 17:16 Article by Daniela Papi-Thornton in the Stanford Social Innovation Review about "heropreneurship" - 20:54 Save the Deli by David Sax - 23:40 The Revenge of Analog by David Sax - 23:52 Maxim's May/June 2018 issue featuring Heidi Klum - 24:40 The Soul of an Entrepreneur on Bookshop.org - 26:15
S1 E80 · Thu, April 16, 2020
Going Remote: Customer Support
Going Remote is a series of bonus episodes where different Basecampers answer questions about how they do their work remotely. In this episode, Merissa Dawson and Chase Clemons answer questions about providing customer support, including how they talk to angry customers and how they onboard new team members. The full version of their Q&A, including a visual walkthrough of the support team's Basecamp account, can be found on YouTube . Show Notes Design lead Jonas Downey's Going Remote episode - 00:18 Basecamp's customer support team - 00:26 Going Remote playlist on YouTube | Full version of Merissa and Chase's session - 00:39 Question 1: How do you talk to customers who are really angry or not nice? - 00:54 Chase talks more about his experience managing a deli in this Rework episode - 2:41 Question 2: Who hops on the calls with customers, someone from Support or from the Product team? - 4:26 Question 3: It's tough right now. What's something you could tell a support specialist from around the world? - 6:18 Question 4: Any tips or tricks for helping onboard new people in customer support, especially when remote? - 8:54 More detail about the Support team's onboarding process is in this Rework episode - 9:42 Basecamp on Twitter - 13:32
S1 E80 · Tue, April 14, 2020
Work Out From Home
Fitness studios, like many other businesses, had to scramble to change over from in-person to virtual operations almost overnight. In this episode, three business owners in the fitness and wellness industry share their stories of how they've pivoted and how they're continuing to look after their communities' well-being during a difficult time. Note: After we wrapped editing on this episode, Haji Healing Salon launched two support groups that meet weekly with a clinical psychologist. If you're interested in signing up, click on "Healing Services" on Haji's website . Show Notes Arts + Public Life residency program at the University of Chicago - 3:14 Haji Healing Salon website | Instagram - 3:19 "Haji Healing Salon Aims to be 'Oasis and Sanctuary' On Bustling 79th Street in Chatham" (Block Club Chicago) - 4:04 Philly Dance Fitness website | Livestream - 7:22 Take It Off Broadway - 8:43 StreamingVideoProvider - 11:10 Punchpass website - 14:21 Punchpass webinar on getting classes online - 17:04 Hot Yoga Burlington - 18:30 "Zoom Rushes to Improve Privacy for Consumers Flooding Its Service" (New York Times) - 23:06
S1 E79 · Thu, April 09, 2020
Going Remote: Design
We're starting a new series of bonus episodes called Going Remote. We'll have different Basecampers answer questions about how they do their work remotely. In this first episode, design lead Jonas Downey talks about how he and his team collaborate with each other, give feedback, and communicate with their developer colleagues. These episodes are adapted from an ongoing series of livestreamed Q&As, which you can find in their entirety on Basecamp's YouTube channel . Show Notes Video of Jonas' Q&A | YouTube playlist of all Q&As - 00:33 Jonas Downey on Twitter - 00:39 Question #1: I’m planning on doing design thinking sessions for groups. How should I channel the team aspect in a virtual call with 20 to 30 people? - 4:25 Question #2: What tools do you use to replace whiteboarding and Post-It sessions? - 6:33 Reflector app - 7:31 Question #3: It seems like most communication you do runs through Basecamp. How do you communicate the intricacies of designs to engineers, and what’s your workflow? - 8:51 Basecamp co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson's live walkthrough of the company's Basecamp account - 8:54 Question #4: Do you use version control tools like Abstract ? - 12:46 Question #5: In the meeting-averse culture of Basecamp, how does design work get reviewed and approved? - 16:23 Question #6: Do you use any design tools, or do you design in the browser? - 17:44 Question #7: Is it required at Basecamp for a designer to know how to code? - 18:48 Question #8: How many designers do you have at Basecamp? - 20:21 Question #9: I'm interested in the dynamic between designers and product managers. Do you do project management yourself using tools like Jira or Trello? - 21:07 Question #10: How do you balance between designer and manager roles? - 23:00 Basecamp on Twitter - 25:35
S1 E79 · Tue, April 07, 2020
Phone a Friend
We're back from hiatus! In this episode, we sit down with Quaker theologian and small business owner Wess Daniels, the author of the book Resisting Empire: The Book of Revelation as Resistance . He talks about the value of silence; reshaping systems of money and power; and building community during a time of struggle. Show Notes Wess Daniels on Twitter | His blog, Gathering In Light - 1:19 Resisting Empire: The Book of Revelation as Resistance (Barclay Press) - 1:27 Friends Center at Guilford College - 2:11 Fireweed Coffee Co - 2:29 Wess's blog post on holding a family meeting - 4:10 Poor People's Campaign - 15:48
S1 E78 · Tue, March 31, 2020
Remote Work: Extreme Edition (Rerun)
We place a long-distance phone call to Antarctica to chat with Kathrin Mallot, an astrophysicist who works at the IceCube Neutrino Observatory in the South Pole. In this episode, Kathrin talks about preparing for a work assignment in a super remote part of the world; practicing self-care during the punishing Antarctic winter; getting along with coworkers that you also live with in close quarters; frozen nose hairs, snacks, Internet access, and more! This episode was originally run in February 2019. Show Notes The IceCube website - 00:46 What is a neutrino? (Scientific American) - 1:13 SNOLAB in Canada is an example of a neutrino observatory located in an old mine - 1:58 Emsisoft - 2:48 Skynet satellite (and the other Skynet ) - 4:38 Mt. Erebus in Antarctica is the southernmost active volcano on the planet - 14:00 The Thing (the 1982 version by John Carpenter) - 19:28 The IceCube website has an entire section about living at the South Pole - 26:53 The defibrillator scene in The Thing (Warning: VERY SCARY! And gross!) - 27:39 The blood test scene in The Thing (Warning: ALSO VERY SCARY AND GROSS) - 27:50
S1 E77 · Wed, March 25, 2020
Remote Work Q&A, Part 2
This is the second part of a two-hour live Q&A on remote work that Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson held last week. Part 2 covers questions about interruptions, mental health, hardware and software tools, and building culture as a remote company. You can find Part 1 on our feed in your podcast app or on our website . If you'd like to watch the Q&A session in its entirety, you can do that on Periscope . You can also check out Basecamp's Guide to Internal Communication . Show Notes Question 1: How do we get aligned with coworkers without interrupting them through chat/phone calls and while respecting their time? - 4:03 Pings (direct messages) in Basecamp - 6:34 Hey is Basecamp's upcoming email product - 7:23 "Interruption Is Not Collaboration," our episode where we discuss Office Hours - 8:45 It Doesn’t Have to be Crazy At Work - 10:48 Question 2: How would you encourage leaders to prepare (or how has Basecamp prepared) for an eventuality where large numbers of workers will be sick for extended periods of time? Adding more buffers to time estimates? - 14:15 Question 3: How can we best nudge our bosses in the right direction with this stuff? - 18:39 The Guardian published an article that mentions DHH's efforts to shame companies whose employees aren't allowed to work from home - 18:57 David's tweet asking for stories of companies - 19:08 Denver Post article about Charter Communications' remote work policy - 19:41 REMOTE: Office Not Required - 21:23 Question 4: Where do you put ideas that are mostly about code? Do you have discussions in GitHub for that? - 25:06 Tuple - 26:58 Question 5: What can you do for taking care of the emotional well-being of the work community that’s going to be remote for weeks in the middle of such unprecedented crises? - 27:32 You can send reports of companies to corona-reports@hey.com - 30:36 Question 6: How do you each spend your typical days at Basecamp? How do you balance team collaboration and meetings with more solo, “deep” work? - 34:33 "Wait, other people can take your time?" (Signal v. N
S1 E77 · Tue, March 24, 2020
The Distance: Steeped In History
Nom Wah Tea Parlor is New York Chinatown’s oldest dim sum restaurant. For decades, it served Cantonese dumplings and rolls in the traditional way, from trolleys pushed around the restaurant. When Wilson Tang took over Nom Wah in 2011, he switched from trolleys to menus with pictures and started serving dim sum through dinner. He also opened new locations that broadened Nom Wah’s repertoire beyond dim sum. These were big changes for a restaurant that opened in 1920, but Wilson saw them as measures to secure Nom Wah’s future for its next century in business. This episode first aired on The Distance in May 2017. Nom Wah has reduced operations due to COVID-19, but you can support the restaurant by purchasing merchandise: https://nomwah.com/shop/ .
S1 E76 · Fri, March 20, 2020
Remote Work Q&A, Part 1
Earlier this week, Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson held a live Q&A about remote work. We're splitting the session into two episodes. Part 1 covers questions about video calls, brainstorming, setting priorities, and good management during a time of stressful transition. If you'd like to watch the Q&A session in its entirety, you can do that on Periscope . You can also check out Basecamp's Guide to Internal Communication . Show Notes Jason and David's book, REMOTE: Office Not Required - 00:55 The full session on Periscope - 1:00 Question 1: In a workplace with a mix of local and remote workers, what are some good strategies for making the remote workers feel more connected and not left out of office events? - 8:12 Basecamp's Automatic Check-ins feature - 9:25 Question 2: How do you qualify employees and gain trust if you don’t meet in person? - 14:14 Question 3: How do you handle the transition in a company that hasn't been very remote until now and can't make a quick switch to writing more? - 18:30 A Guide to Managing Remote Teams by Claire Lew, CEO of Know Your Team - 19:40 Question 4: How do you handle video meetings with more than 20 people? - 23:44 "Is group chat making you sweat?" (Signal v. Noise) - 30:00 Question 5: How do you prioritize tasks? What's your productivity system or non-system? - 30:14 Shape Up , Basecamp's book about product development - 30:50 Question 6: Do you believe any developer/designer/product manager can work remotely? - 36:09 Question 7: How would you host a brainstorming meeting? - 38:17 Question 8: How do you properly handle large layoffs of more than 10 people? - 40:51 "Stanley's Abruptly Closes After 52 Years of Selling Affordable Produce, Longtime Workers Caught Off Guard" (Block Club Chicago) - 44:30 Question 9: What are the key things I can do as a manager of a small team to make remote working a great experience within my team, even if our company culture is still catching up after being forced to go full remote? - 46:02
S1 E76 · Tue, March 17, 2020
The (Social) Distance
Basecamp is a remote company, so we're less disrupted by the current pandemic than many other businesses, but we're still taking steps to keep folks safe. Jason Fried talks about canceling the company's April meetup and closing the Chicago office. Rework will be taking a few weeks off so we can get set up with recording studios at home. In the meantime, if you're working from home for the first time, we'd love to hear your stories! Please get in touch at hello@rework.fm (you can write an email or send us a voice memo) or leave us a voicemail at 708-628-7850. Show Notes Tearing the heart out of Saturday night - 00:06 Joe Bob Briggs' series, The Last Drive-In - 0:14 Joe Bob Briggs: How Rednecks Saved Hollywood - 00:27 Our recent episode about leaving the Chicago office - 1:10 RailsConf - 5:59 The Distance - 8:57 Wailin learned about fomites from this 2013 New Yorker article and now she won't stop talking about them - 10:46
S1 E75 · Tue, March 10, 2020
Work, Rest, and What You Will
We at Basecamp love to preach the virtues of the 8-hour work day, but where did it come from? (Hint: Not from Henry Ford!) Labor historian Emily Twarog explains the origins of the 8-hour work day and why it was so short-lived in the U.S. Show Notes "This CEO thinks it's crazy to work more than 40 hours a week" (CNN) - 00:34 "Extreme Capitalism with Jason Calacanis," the episode that credits Henry Ford with the 8-hour work day - 1:04 "Did the 8-hour day and the 40-hour week come from Henry Ford, or labor unions?" (Politifact) - 1:06 Emily Twarog | Twitter - 1:10 "The Mill Girls of Lowell" (National Park Service) - 1:54 The Lowell Offering - 3:04 "Fire of 1871" (Encyclopedia of Chicago) - 3:51 A history of McCormick's reaper works factory - 4:59 An overview of the Haymarket Riot - 5:24 A history of the Bread and Roses Strike of 1912 - 5:54 The U.S. Department of Labor's history of the Fair Labor Standards Act - 11:02 The National Labor Relations Board's FAQs on the National Labor Relations Act - 11:06 Fight for $15 - 29:17 "She was Instacart's biggest cheerleader. Now she's leading a worker revolt" (Washington Post) - 29:29 Emily Twarog's book, Politics of the Pantry: Housewives, Food, and Consumer Protest in Twentieth-Century America - 31:25 Beaten Down, Worked Up: The Past, Present, and Future of American Labor by Steven Greenhouse - 31:36 On the Clock: What Low-Wage Work Did to Me and How It Drives America Insane by Emily Guendelsberger - 31:45
S1 E74 · Tue, March 03, 2020
Rug Life
Jarred Lustgarten left a Wall Street career to start a rug-cleaning business with $600 in borrowed money and a stack of flyers. A decade later, J.L. Carpet & Upholstery is profitable and Jarred has a very visible reminder on his hands of his commitment to his vocation. Show Notes Irin Carmon's website | Twitter - 00:40 J.L. Carpet & Upholstery - 1:23 Irin's tweet about Jarred's tattoo | Jarred's tattoo - 1:50 New York Daily News columnist Harry Siegel's tweet in response - 2:18 New York Rug Life - 2:49 Lisa Wagner's website, Rug Chick - 15:52 Park Slope Parents - 17:39 Notorious RBG: The Life and Times of Ruth Bader Ginsburg by Irin Carmon and Shana Knizhnik - 26:32
S1 E73 · Tue, February 25, 2020
Delete Your Account
Basecamp the app is over 15 years old, which means Basecamp the company is responsible for safeguarding more than a decade's worth of customer data—including 370 terabytes of data stored in non-active accounts. In this episode, Basecamp data analyst Jane Yang talks about a big, ongoing project at the company to clean up those inactive accounts and give former customers what we all deserve: the right to be forgotten on the Internet. Two Basecamp alums also return to share the history of the company's data incineration protocol. Show Notes Jamis Buck on Twitter - 2:05 Jason Fried's tribute to Jamis - 2:22 Eileen Uchitelle's website | Twitter - 3:15 the tweet by @FiloSottile about data being uranium, not gold - 7:04 our episode about the credential stuffing attack - 13:04 blog post explaining how Basecamp notified customers about the credential stuffing - 13:32 Basecamp's cancellation policy - 21:46 Basecamp Personal - 21:53 Tom Anderson from MySpace is on Instagram now and his profile photo should look familiar - 23:48 Mazes for Programmers by Jamis Buck - 26:24 Basil & Fabian by Jamis Buck - 26:25
S1 E72 · Thu, February 20, 2020
Extreme Capitalism with Jason Calacanis
Basecamp co-founder and CTO David Heinemeier Hansson and entrepreneur and angel investor Jason Calacanis debate the gig economy, democratic socialism, and whether the American dream is dead. The conversation in this episode is adapted from a longer interview that can be found in full at This Week in Startups .
S1 E72 · Tue, February 18, 2020
Poetry at Work
Some of our most famous poets had day jobs: Robert Burns was a tax collector; William Carlos Williams was a doctor; Audre Lorde was a librarian and professor. Poetry has a lot to say about work and can serve as a meeting place, a provocative memo, or a break from the daily grind. In this episode, we hear from the creator of Poetry At Work Day and the editor of Poetry magazine about the power of verse in the workplace. And some Basecamp colleagues share poems that are meaningful to them. Show Notes Days of the Year - 00:08 The origins of "Be A Pineapple" - 00:55 Poetry At Work Day 2020 - 2:00 Take Your Poet to Work Day - 2:18 Laura Barkat's website | Twitter - 2:26 "The African Chief" by William Cullen Bryant - 2:45 Tweetspeak Poetry - 3:06 "Wasp" by Tony Hoagland - 4:12 Don Share | Poetry magazine - 5:04 "The Instruction Manual" by John Ashbery - 5:22 "Toads" by Philip Larkin - 6:22 Our recent episode about moving out of Basecamp's current office - 6:57 "My First Memory (of Librarians)" by Nikki Giovanni - 7:06 "Evangeline" by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow - 8:08 Tweetspeak Poetry's Daily Poem email - 11:58 The Poetry Foundation's Audio Poem of the Day - 12:05 The Slowdown podcast - 12:11 "On Clothes" by Kahlil Gibran - 13:15 "This Is Just To Say" by William Carlos Williams - 14:41 "This is just to
S1 E71 · Tue, February 11, 2020
Try Everything
Every year for the past decade, Mert Iseri has chosen a new skill to learn. This annual challenge has taken him from a magicians' club to chess tournaments where he's competed against eight-year-olds. In this episode, Mert talks about chasing the joy of being challenged just the right amount and what he's learned from being an enthusiastic beginner. Show Notes Mert Iseri on Twitter - 2:49 Basecamp's Continuing Education Allowance benefit - 3:22 SwipeSense - 4:45 The Game of the Century - 8:24 Chess Grandmaster Maurice Ashley - 9:15 Pioneers Palaces - 10:03 Garry Kasparov's seminar on MasterClass - 10:14 Flow by Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi - 14:49 Lillstreet Art Center - 21:44 It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work by Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson - 24:33 Chicago Magic Lounge - 28:59 Chicago Magic Round Table - 30:00 Free Solo - 32:56 Max Maven performs B'Wave - 38:52
S1 E70 · Tue, February 04, 2020
The Road Out Of Startupland
Sahil Lavingia once believed his startup was headed for unicorn status, but his journey through Silicon Valley—the viral launch on Hacker News, $8 million in venture capital, the glowing press—led to a very different outcome. In this episode, Sahil reflects on life outside the literal and figurative confines of Silicon Valley, and the satisfaction he gets from building a sustainable business. Show Notes "Is Venture Capital Worth the Risk?" (The New Yorker) - 00:51 "The deal Jeff Bezos got on Basecamp" (Signal v. Noise) - 1:55 Sahil Lavingia on Twitter | Gumroad - 2:05 Vibram shoes - 6:00 Jon Wheatley founded DailyBooth , a YCombinator company - 7:22 "Pinterest Has Already Pinned Down $10M At A $40M Valuation" (TechCrunch) - 7:31 Bebo is a now-defunct social networking company - 7:54 "SoftBank's Vision Fund Is a Graveyard of Broken Tech Startups" (Vice) - 9:47 "Gumroad Gets $7 Million Series A From Kleiner Perkins For Indie E-Payment Platform" (TechCrunch) - 11:43 Basecamp Personal - 15:45 Her (film) on Wikipedia - 21:01 The 4-Hour Workweek - 29:10 Sahil's big essay on his experience, "Reflecting on My Failure to Build a Billion-Dollar Company" (Medium) - 32:58
S1 E69 · Tue, January 28, 2020
Mr. DHH Goes to Washington
Basecamp co-founder and Chief Technology Officer David Heinemeier Hansson has been ranting on Twitter about monopolistic practices in Big Tech for a while, and he recently got an unexpected opportunity to air his grievances about Google, Apple, and Facebook in front of a congressional subcommittee. In this episode, David debriefs on his experience and Basecamp's data analyst, Jane Yang, talks about her work helping David prepare for his appearance. Show Notes Judiciary Committee page about the hearing, including a video of the event - 1:37 "Pick A Fight," our episode about why David enjoys arguing on Twitter - 2:38 "Open Source Beyond the Market," David's 2019 RailsConf keynote - 4:59 "The Google Ads Shakedown," our episode about our displeasure with the way Google handles ads in search results - 5:51 "100% Facebook-Free," our episode about pulling Basecamp from Facebook, Instagram, and WhatsApp - 6:42 Previous subcommittee hearings on "Online Platforms and Market Power" - 8:01 David's prepared remarks - 8:35 Congressman Ken Buck - 11:25 The other witnesses were Patrick Spence of Sonos , David Barnett of PopSockets , and Kirsten Daru of Tile - 12:13 "PopSockets CEO says Amazon uses 'bullying with a smile' to press for lower prices" (CNBC) - 13:02 "Everything we know about Apple's Tile-like item tracking device" (9to5Mac) - 19:22 "Apple's Flashlight Is Why We Can't Fund Nice Dumb Things" (TechCrunch) - 19:40 The story of Steve Jobs calling Dropbox a "feature" is recounted in this 2011 Fortune article - 20:23 "Here's how we can break up Big Tech" (Elizabeth Warren) - 26:29 <a href=
S1 E68 · Tue, January 21, 2020
You Never Forget George Pappageorge
Basecamp CEO Jason Fried is back in the studio with an update on the company's Chicago headquarters. Basecamp will be leaving its office this summer after a 10-year run, and Jason is looking at a number of options—including a space that will bring him full circle with one of his original 37signals partners. Show Notes "Office Space," our last episode about the fate of the Chicago office - 00:45 Brininstool+Lynch , the architects behind Basecamp's office - 6:54 Carlos Segura , who co-founded 37signals with Jason and Ernest Kim - 13:13 Coudal Partners is the Chicago design firm that makes Field Notes - 20:49 Chicago artist Nate Otto has worked with Basecamp for many years - 21:17 You never forget George Pappageorge - 21:33
S1 E67 · Tue, January 14, 2020
Less Business, More d20s
Matthew Vincent, a member of Basecamp's Ops team, spoke at Nomad City 2019 about life as a remote worker. Close your eyes and pretend you're in the Canary Islands as you listen to this audio version of Matthew's talk. Show Notes Matthew Vincent's Nomad City speaker bio - 00:30 Nomad City - 00:34 d20 System (Wikipedia) - 1:23 "Thirteen Months of Working, Sleeping, and Eating at the Googleplex" (Bloomberg Businessweek, July 2015) - 2:21 "Which Googler holds the record for living at Google HQ?" (Quora) - 2:23 Ben Discoe's LinkedIn - 3:06 Entry in Basecamp's handbook about the Continuing Education Allowance - 7:18 The tweet that Matthew references - 9:00 Automatic Check-ins - 14:00 Basecamp's Employee Handbook - 21:36 Shape Up by Ryan Singer, Basecamp's guide to product development - 21:48 All of Basecamp's books - 22:03 Videos for Nomad City 2019 talks - 28:45
S1 E66 · Tue, January 07, 2020
Welcome Aboard
Welcome back! We're kicking off the new year with an episode full of practical advice about onboarding new employees. Ashley Bowe from Basecamp's customer support team talks about how they welcome and train new colleagues, and leadership coach Karen Catlin of Better Allies shares advice and examples of what companies can do to build more inclusive cultures. Show Notes Basecamp's Support team - 00:47 The Better Allies Approach to Hiring by Karen Catlin - 1:03 "Hire When It Hurts," our episode about hiring - 2:51 Entry in Basecamp's handbook about summer hours - 6:44 "I've never had a goal" (Signal v. Noise) - 7:36 Shaun talks about not eating lunch for a week in "Workaholics Aren't Heroes" - 9:03 Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson write about the joy of missing out in this Quartz essay - 14:39 Karen Catlin on Twitter | her website | Better Allies on Twitter | Better Allies website - 19:28 The Uber leather jacket debacle was chronicled by Susan J. Fowler in her now-famous essay about working at Uber - 22:43
S1 E65 · Tue, December 24, 2019
BONUS - The Knight Before Christmas
Listeners may remember that last year Wailin watched ALL of the holiday rom-coms and decided to share them with me on our ill-advised holiday bonus episode. Well, we're bringing it back! This year Wailin made Shaun watch The Knight Before Christmas. It's got magic, chivalry, time travel, wide-legged pants, and an inexplicable post-credit scene. Is the holiday bonus episode still ill-advised? Yes. But, is it fun? Also, yes! Happy Holidays to all of our listeners and we'll be back in 2020 with more stories.
S1 E65 · Tue, December 17, 2019
Are The Kids Alright?
In this anxious era of bullying, teen depression, and school shootings, tech companies are selling software to schools and parents that make big promises about keeping kids secure by monitoring what they say and write online. But these apps demand disturbing trade-offs in the name of safety. In this episode, we dive into the normative, privacy, and transparency implications of this software for both schools and families, and examine how the rush to fix societal problems with technology can amplify harm to young people while enriching companies that stand to profit from increased surveillance. Show Notes Gennie Gebhart's bio | Twitter - 00:38 Electronic Frontier Foundation - 1:02 The EFF's 2017 report on student privacy (PDF) - 1:12 "Facial Recognition Tech Comes to Schools and Summer Camps" (Wall Street Journal) - 1:32 "Heal the Internet," our episode on removing tracking pixels from emails - 2:06 "Big Brother at the Office," our episode on workplace surveillance - 2:10 Previous episodes on Big Tech include "100% Facebook-Free, " "The Google Ads Shakedown," and "Nevermore, Amazon" - 3:19 "Breaking the Black Box," our episode about algorithmic bias - 3:24 Caroline Haskins on Twitter | her stories for Vice | her stories for BuzzFeed News - 3:51 BuzzFeed News' series on schools and surveillance - 4:04 "Gaggle Knows Everything About Teens And Kids In School" (BuzzFeed News) - 4:06 Gaggle - 4:08 Bark - 7:05 This Vice article takes a closer look at Bark's self-reported safety statistics in North and South Carolina - 7:29 ManagedMethods - 8:31 <a href='https://help.bark.us/en/articles/2670
S1 E64 · Tue, December 10, 2019
Lab Week
Get out your Bunsen burner! It's time to do some experiments. In this episode, we talk to two businesses that aren't afraid to try new things. First, the three founders of The Mad Optimist, a soap company in Indiana, talk about letting customers choose what they pay for their products. Then Natalie Nagele, the co-founder and CEO of software company Wildbit, talks about an ongoing experiment with four-day work weeks and what she's discovered about productivity, happiness, and deep work. Show Notes The Mad Optimist website | Facebook | Instagram - 00:45 You can find The Mad Optimist's live revenue number in their Humanifesto under "We practice radical transparency" - 9:43 Natalie Nagele on Twitter - 16:51 Wildbit website - 16:53 Basecamp's entry on Summer Hours in the company handbook - 16:57 Deep Work by Cal Newport - 18:54
S1 E63 · Tue, December 03, 2019
Venture Capital and Control with Dave Teare
Dave Teare is the co-founder and official "heart and soul" of 1Password, which recently raised $200 million in its first round of venture capital. Basecamp is a longtime happy customer of 1Password and also a longtime critic of venture capital, so the funding announcement led to some back-and-forth on Twitter between Basecamp co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson and Dave Teare. In this episode, DHH and Dave get on the phone to hash out their feelings about venture capital and what this funding round means for 1Password's future. Show Notes " Open Source and Power with Matt Mullenweg ," our episode featuring a phone call between DHH and Automattic's Matt Mullenweg - 00:34 DHH's tweet about Automattic's funding round - 00:49 Dave Teare on Twitter | 1Password - 00:56 1Password's blog post announcing the funding round - 1:02 DHH's tweet about 1Password's funding announcement - 1:04 "A love letter to DHH and others concerned about our recent funding announcement" - 1:30 "Bezos Expeditions invests in 37signals" (Signal v. Noise) - 1:55 1Password co-founder Roustem Karimov on Twitter - 3:10 DHH's Ruby on Rails demo about building a blog engine in 15 minutes - 3:30 "Conceal, don't feel" is a lyric from Frozen's Let It Go - 14:14 "Inside WeWork's week from hell: How the mass layoffs went down" (CNN) - 19:16 "The day I became a millionaire" (Signal v. Noise) - 21:22 "It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work" - 25:31 Apple's Differential Privacy policy (PDF) - 26:25 Our Incredible Journey (Tumblr) - 31:42 "The Mess at Meetup" (Gizmodo) - 32:08 "Meetup wants to charge users $2 just to RSVP for eve
S1 E62 · Tue, November 26, 2019
Calm in the Political Storm
Workplace cultures in politics and tech share many similarities: Overwork is glorified; long hours are the norm; employees are expected to respond to communication instantly, no matter the day or time; and those that opt out are seen as lacking hustle or ceding ground to competitors. Marty Santalucia, a political consultant in Pennsylvania, wanted to do things differently. In this episode, he talks about applying calm work principles to an industry that's known for the opposite dynamic. Show Notes NPR's Up First podcast - 00:51 FiveThirtyEight's Politics podcast - 00:55 Dan Sinker's website | Twitter - 1:15 impeachment.fyi - 1:21 Marty Santalucia on Twitter - 2:55 MFStrategies website | Twitter - 2:58 "Sanders Campaign, Workers Ratify Union Contract" (NPR) - 22:23 Bonus link! The New York Times asked 2020 Democratic candidates how much sleep they get a night and filmed the responses .
S1 E61 · Fri, November 22, 2019
BONUS - Basecamp: This Time It's Personal
Basecamp has a long history of experimenting with "freemium" models and recently launched its most generous free plan yet: Basecamp Personal. Co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about the debate and data analysis that went into the launch, what makes this a little scary, and why it's healthy for a business to experiment. Show Notes "Launch: Basecamp Gets Personal" (Signal v. Noise) - 00:13 37signals' 2004 announcement about the launch of Basecamp - 1:44 Basecamp's announcement about closing Backpack to new signups - 2:18 "Launch: Basecamp 3" (Signal v. Noise) - 2:31 Our episode about finding an SEO consultant - 7:10 Our episode introducing Basecamp's new head of marketing - 7:18 Basecamp's ace Support team - 23:46 Our episode about the Apple Card controversy and algorithmic bias - 25:06 Basecamp Personal on Product Hunt - 26:10 Basecamp's "Until the End of the Internet" policy - 26:53
S1 E61 · Tue, November 19, 2019
Spending in the Clouds
Basecamp has cut back its reliance on Amazon and Google, but there's one area where it's tough to find alternatives to Big Tech: cloud services. Even so, there are ways to cut spending on this $3 million annual expense while keeping the company's apps running smoothly. In this episode, Blake Stoddard on Basecamp's Ops team talks about how he volunteered to look for savings on cloud services and really delivered—to the tune of over a half-million dollars. Show Notes Blake Stoddard on Twitter - 1:27 AWS Lambda - 4:45 The Reddit hug of death is also known as the Slashdot effect - 4:55 Maybe Roxane Gay can save us from our cord-cutting dystopia - 15:49
S1 E60 · Fri, November 15, 2019
BONUS - Breaking the Black Box
Basecamp co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson sparked a national controversy this week when he posted a series of livid tweets about how his wife received a much lower credit limit than he did on their Apple Cards, despite applying with the same financial information. What began as a rant against opaque algorithms turned into a regulatory investigation and more. In this episode, Dr. Ruha Benjamin of Princeton University and entrepreneur Mara Zepeda, co-founder of the XXcelerate Fund and Zebras Unite, talk about how the tech and financial sectors perpetuate systemic inequalities and how to start repairing the damage—or building something more equitable and inclusive from the ground up. Show Notes Apple Card - 1:31 DHH's Twitter thread - 1:53 Steve Wozniak's response - 1:58 The New York Department of Financial Services' announcement of its investigation into Goldman Sachs - 2:11 "About the Apple Card" (Jamie Heinemeier Hansson) - 2:28 Ruha Benjamin's website | Twitter - 2:57 Race After Technology by Ruha Benjamin - 2:59 University of Michigan article about the failures of the state's MiDAS system - 7:31 "Racial bias in a medical algorithm favors white patients over sicker black patients" (Washington Post) - 8:18 "Biased bots: Artificial-intelligence systems echo human prejudices" (Princeton University) - 12:40 "Amazon scraps secret AI recruiting tool that showed bias against women" (Reuters) - 14:15 Ruha Benjamin's Resources - 15:29 Joy Buolamwini on Twitter - 16:52 "Atlanta Asks Google Whether It Targeted Black Homeless People" (NYT) - 17:40 <a href='https://www.cdc.gov/tuskegee/
S1 E60 · Tue, November 12, 2019
Big Brother at the Office
Jason Meller - 00:25 "What is SSL?" - 1:13 This is Outback Steakhouse's page for the Bloomin' Onion , which is categorized as an "Aussie-tizer." Yes, that's what Outback calls appetizers. I cannot un-know this fact and now I pass it to you. - 2:43 "At an Outback Steakhouse Franchise, Surveillance Blooms" (Wired) - 2:51 "Presto Launches Computer Vision Product for Real-Time Restaurant Operations Insights" (Presto press release) - 3:18 "The Employer-Surveillance State" (The Atlantic) - 3:40 Kolide - 5:45 Basecamp's security overview with a mention of Shipshape (PDF) - 20:54 "Introducing Netflix Stethoscope" (The Netflix Tech Blog) - 20:58
S1 E59 · Tue, November 05, 2019
Rework Mailbag 5
Simulacra and Simulation by Jean Baudrillard - 2:57 Max Temkin is a Chicagoan and a co-creator of Cards Against Humanity - 4:01 Little Free Library - 4:04 Maverick by Ricardo Semler - 4:48 Berkshire Hathaway shareholder letters by Warren Buffett - 5:27 Amazon's 2018 shareholder letter by Jeff Bezos - 5:38 Listen to our previous episodes about hiring a director of marketing, "In the Market for a Marketer" and "Meet Andy" - 13:02
S1 E58 · Tue, October 29, 2019
A Hosty Retreat
Art19 - 1:02 The Distance - 1:09 Tweet from Kevin Finn to DHH / "Heal the Internet" - 1:15 Buzzsprout - 1:21 Video about Art19's new ad technology - 1:28 DHH's tweet about leaving Art19 ASAP - 3:23 Transistor - 3:52 Lex Friedman - 4:16 "Breaking: Two Top Stitcher Executives leave for Art19" (Hot Pod) - 10:58 California Consumer Privacy Act (Wikipedia) - 23:20 Justin Jackson - 40:24 Jon Buda - 40:34 The Good News Podcast , a show by Cards Against Humanity - 40:45 "Crafting Radio's Driveway Moments" (NPR) - 42:26 Sleep With Me podcast - 56:38 Justin Jackson's post on getting to $30K - 58:21 DHH's personal website - 1:02:27
S1 E57 · Tue, October 22, 2019
Meet Andy
"In the Market for a Marketer," our previous episode - 00:22 Andy Didorosi | Detroit Bus Co. - 00:50 "How Detroit ended up with the worst public transit" (Detroit Metro Times, 2014) - 1:45 "Baby Shark (doo doo do doo do doo), explained" (Vox) - 16:00 Jalopnik - 17:15 Andy's talk at the 2014 Adobe 99U Conference, "What Detroit Taught Me About Getting Things Done" - 19:04 "Eminem Opens a 'Mom's Spaghetti' Pop-Up in Detroit" (Vice, 2017) - 19:50 Small Giants - 20:24
S1 E56 · Tue, October 15, 2019
In the Market for a Marketer
"Hire When It Hurts," our previous episode about hiring - 00:57 "Farewell, Happy Camper," our episode about rebranding Basecamp - 1:51 A Signal v. Noise post by Jason about design challenges for job candidates - 4:26 Detroit Bus Co. - 11:17
S1 E55 · Tue, October 08, 2019
Nevermore, Amazon
She Said: Breaking the Sexual Harassment Story That Helped Ignite a Movement by Jodi Kantor and Megan Twohey (IndieBound.org) - 00:40 Playing at the World: A History of Simulating Wars, People and Fantastic Adventures, from Chess to Role-Playing Games by Jon Peterson (IndieBound.org) - 1:14 "Independent Women," our previous podcast's episode about Women & Children First bookstore - 1:31 "Heal the Internet," our episode where David Heinemeier Hansson endorsed IndieBound - 2:00 Danny Caine's website - 2:37 The Raven Book Store's website | Twitter | Instagram - 2:40 The Raven's viral Twitter thread from April 2019 - 6:46 "Amazon will pay $0 in taxes on $11,200,000,000 in profit for 2018" (Yahoo Finance) - 10:10 Books Are Magic - 11:00 Caitlin Doughty - 13:17 "Margaret Atwood's Handmaid's Tale sequel escapes from tight secrecy" (The Guardian) - 14:46 The Raven's Twitter thread about the embargo on The Testaments - 16:36 The huge demand for Michelle Obama's memoir affected printing capacity for Basecamp cofounders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson's book, which came out in the fall 2018. We covered those issues in this episode - 19:19 Salt, Fat, Acid, Heat by Samin Nosrat - 19:28 The Raven's Twitter thread on bestsellers - 20:23 Quoth the Raven newsletter - 20:30 Paradise Cafe Cookbook by Missy McCoy - 21:24 El Dorado Freddy's , Danny Caine's forthcoming book of poetry - 23:38 The Nickel Boys by Colson Whitehead - 24:38 <a href='https://www.indiebound.org/book/97
S1 E54 · Tue, October 01, 2019
Open Source and Power with Matt Mullenweg
DHH on Twitter - 00:53 Matt Mullenweg's website | Twitter - 00:57 The Twitter conversation that started the debate - 1:07 WordPress.org - 1:40 Automattic website - 1:45 Automattic's Series D funding announcement - 1:54 Matt Mullenweg's interview with TechCrunch - 3:30 "Netflix CEO Reed Hastings: Sleep Is Our Competition" (Fast Company) - 9:19 A 2005 demo by DHH on creating a blog engine in 15 minutes - 16:49 "The deal Jeff Bezos got on Basecamp" (Signal v. Noise) - 24:16 Benevolent dictator for life (Wikipedia) - 46:21 DHH on the Django Chat podcast - 46:37 "Richard Stallman resigns from MIT over Epstein comments" (The Verge) - 47:15 Automattic Acquires Tumblr from Verizon - 56:17
S1 E53 · Tue, September 24, 2019
Heal the Internet
Mike Davidson's blog post on Superhuman, "Superhuman is Spying on You" - 00:13 Mike Davidson's tweet about Superhuman - 00:35 "Marking the end of pixel trackers in Basecamp emails" and "Let's stop shaking people down for their email addresses" (Signal v. Noise) - 00:57 "You can heal the internet" (Signal v. Noise) - 1:18 The EU's official website about GDPR - 11:00 "California Passes Sweeping Law to Protect Online Privacy" (New York Times) - 11:08 Basecamp stopped reimbursing employees for Uber rides in 2017. DHH elaborates on that decision in our episode "Take A Stand" - 15:26 IndieBound - 16:37 DuckDuckGo - 17:45 "Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg says the 'future is private'" (The Verge) - 21:46 "Facebook Has Watched You Browse The Web For Years. And No, 'Clear History' Won't Really Stop It" (BuzzFeed News) - 22:15 Our episode on becoming 100% Facebook Free - 22:28 "Mister Gotcha," a four-panel cartoon by Matt Bors - 22:55 A lavina is an avalanche - 26:00 The U.S. Federal Trade Commission's page about the Equifax data breach - 29:21 "Apple apologizes for listening to Siri conversations" (CNBC) - 30:30
S1 E52 · Tue, September 17, 2019
Slow Fashion
A GQ profile of Japan's Kapital Denim - 1:26 Pure Blue jeans - 1:44 Meghan Markle - 2:39 For a great peek into the denim industry and its environmental impact, we recommend this episode of the Articles of Interest podcast - 2:57 David Hieatt - 3:18 Hiut Denim | Facebook | Instagram | Twitter - 3:20 A 2002 BBC story about the closure of the Dewhirst jeans plant in Cardigan - 3:58 Howies - 4:20 A selvedge denim explainer - 5:25 A story in the Independent about Meghan Markle wearing Hiut's jeans - 13:56 Denim Breaker Club - 17:52 No Wash Club - 21:46 Do Purpose : Why Brands With a Purpose Do Better and Matter More by David Hieatt - 24:35 The DO Lectures - 24:42
S1 E51 · Tue, September 10, 2019
Farewell, Happy Camper
Basecamp.com - 00:19 Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 00:29 "Connecting the dots: How we put a smile on the Basecamp logo" (Signal v. Noise, October 2015) - 1:22 You can see the 37signals logo in the upper right corner of this website - 3:48 37signals changed its name to Basecamp in 2014 - 4:20 Jonathan Van Ness - 5:23 Garmin's BaseCamp - 6:51 The original 37signals manifesto - 8:40 Pentagram - 11:35 UnderConsideration's review of the new logo - 14:40
S1 E52 · Thu, September 05, 2019
BONUS - The Google Ads Shakedown
Jason's tweet - 00:18 " Six Hours of Phone Calls ," our episode about hiring an SEO consultant - 00:44 Adam Stoddard , Basecamp's marketing designer - 2:17 CNBC's story on Jason's tweet - 3:35 CNN story on Burger King's mobile app promotion that trolled McDonald's - 10:18
S1 E50 · Tue, September 03, 2019
The Cult of Overwork
Ty Fujimura on Twitter - 00:52 Ty's Medium essay , "The Cult of Overwork (And How to Avoid It)" - 00:54 Cantilever website - 1:10 Cal Newport's website - 8:47 "The Cult of Overwork," James Surowiecki's New Yorker piece - 22:56 Wild Hearts Can't Be Broken - 25:54 (Wailin would like to say that she describes the circus trick incorrectly: The rider actually mounts a moving horse before diving off the platform. Wailin would also like to say that she corrected herself on mic but Shaun cut that part.)
S1 E51 · Tue, August 27, 2019
BONUS - 37signals Podcast - Q&A with Jason and David
We're taking off the month of August! During our hiatus, we'll be playing some vintage episodes of the 37signals Podcast, a show that Basecamp ran from 2009-2011 (and then forgot all about until Wailin came across the show during an unrelated Google search). In this episode, Basecamp (then 37signals) co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson answer questions from Signal v. Noise readers about the company's affiliate program, staying motivated, playing the stock market, and more. We'll be back with new episodes of Rework next week!
S1 E50 · Tue, August 20, 2019
BONUS - 37signals Podcast - Making People Pay
We're taking off the month of August! During our hiatus, we'll be playing some vintage episodes of the 37signals Podcast, a show that Basecamp ran from 2009-2011 (and then forgot all about until Wailin came across the show during an unrelated Google search). In this episode, Basecamp (then 37signals) co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson talk about when to give something away and when to charge.
S1 E49 · Tue, August 13, 2019
BONUS - 37signals Podcast - Valuation Tales
We're taking off the month of August! During our hiatus, we'll be playing some vintage episodes of the 37signals Podcast, a show that Basecamp ran from 2009-2011 (and then forgot all about until Wailin came across the show during an unrelated Google search). In this episode, Basecamp (then 37signals) co-founders Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson discuss a satirical press release they wrote to skewer overblown tech company valuations. That leads to a broader discussion about investment, exits, and serial entrepreneurship.
S1 E49 · Tue, August 06, 2019
No Half Measures
Our previous two episodes, Shape Up and Shape Up Roundtable - 00:37 Welcome Industries website | Twitter | Instagram - 1:16 Pam's bio at Northwestern University - 1:31 Brandon Williams' website - 3:31 Umbra - 3:39 Brandon's original idea for Float | Umbra product page - 3:54 Kickstarter for the cork bag - 5:23 Kickstarter for the photo frame - 5:56 Kickstarter for the measuring cups - 6:52 Most funded Kickstarter campaigns - 7:31 Yanko Design's Instagram - 13:01 International Home + Housewares Show - 13:53 Janler Corporation - 14:41 The cups are made of a plastic called Tritan - 18:58 Crazing is cracking on the surface of an object - 19:07 MoMA Design Store - 22:35 Welcome Industries page to purchase the cups - 23:48 Drink those claws - 27:19 Wailin's explanation of "Hot Girl Summer" is mortifyingly inaccurate, so read this explainer instead - 27:28
S1 E48 · Tue, July 30, 2019
Shape Up Roundtable
Last week's episode , an introduction to Shape Up - 00:11 Shape Up: Stop Running in Circles and Ship Work that Matters by Ryan Singer - 00:18 Ryan Singer on Twitter - 1:18 Conor Muirhead on Twitter - 1:22 Jeff Hardy on Twitter - 1:27 "Get One Piece Done" - 5:08 "Affordances before pixel-perfect screens" - 10:02 "Work is like a hill" - 12:44 "The circuit breaker" - 21:16 "Risks and Rabbit Holes" - 22:15 "Watch out for grab-bags" - 23:43 "Decide When to Stop" - 25:50 "Bets, Not Backlogs" - 28:26
S1 E47 · Tue, July 23, 2019
Shape Up with Ryan Singer
Books by Basecamp - 00:13 Shape Up: Stop Running in Circles and Ship Work that Matters - 00:17 Ryan on Twitter - 00:19 Breadboard on Wikipedia and in Shape Up - 6:30 Forrest M. Mims III on Wikipedia - 7:00 "Planning is Guessing," our episode featuring Jason Fried on six-week cycles (his segment starts at 10:03). See also his Signal v. Noise post, "What six weeks of work looks like" - 13:20 "Bets, not Backlogs," a chapter in Shape Up - 16:17 The section on appetite in Shape Up - 17:13 The section on the circuit breaker in Shape Up - 19:16
S1 E46 · Tue, July 16, 2019
Hire When It Hurts
Big Integer , our episode about the outage - 3:56 DHH's posts on subsequent outages - 3:59 "Basecamp is hiring a Head of Marketing" (Signal v. Noise) - 6:15 archive of past talks by Basecampers - 6:29 Books by Basecamp - 6:30 Six Hours of Phone Calls , our episode about looking for an SEO consultant to help with Basecamp's Google ranking - 6:46 Basecamp Support - 8:28 "Basecamp is hiring Customer Support Representatives" (SvN) - 8:38 "We're hiring a Director of Operations" (SvN) - 9:19 "Basecamp is hiring a Senior Programmer" (SvN) - 11:12 Workable - 14:38 Hiring Is Not Hazing , our episode about code reviews and other aspects of tech interviews - 20:00 Know Your Team , our episode about the company formerly known as the product Know Your Company - 29:25 "Why work doesn't happen at work," Jason Fried's 2010 TEDxMidwest talk - 31:27
S1 E45 · Tue, July 09, 2019
Last Week with Jason Fried: Six Hours of Phone Calls
Adam Stoddard on Twitter - 00:45 Jason's tweet asking for SEO consultant recommendations - 1:36 For more on design challenges as part of the hiring process, check out our episode "Hiring Is Not Hazing" - 4:12
S1 E45 · Tue, July 02, 2019
The Open Office
A peek inside Basecamp's office in Chicago - 00:21 "The open-plan office is a terrible, horrible, no good, very bad idea" (Signal v. Noise) - 00:34 "Library Rules: How to make an open office plan work" (Signal v. Noise) - 00:43 Tommy George on Twitter - 1:30 YouVersion Bible app - 1:31 Zemana - 13:39
S1 E44 · Tue, June 25, 2019
Long-Time Snacker, First-Time Caller
Nikki Sylianteng on Twitter - 00:34 "Thanks to Popular Demand, Planters Cheez Balls and Cheez Curls Are Back" (Kraft Heinz press release) - 2:54 Nikki's tweets about eating Cheez Curls - 3:24
S1 E44 · Tue, June 18, 2019
We Love the Subs
Jonas Downey on Twitter - 00:08 Quiznos website - 00:21 "We Love the Subs" commercial - 00:46 Joel Veitch's site, Rathergood - 3:04 Tarsier on Wikipedia - 4:29 "We Like the Moon" video - 5:27 Ty Harper's website - 5:45 The Martin Agency website - 5:49 Kerry Feuerman's website - 6:30 Quiznos coupon commercial - 15:57 Quiznos Huns commercial - 16:00 REGO Restaurant Group on LinkedIn - 21:51 "Where's the Shop? Cliff Freeman Slips Into History Books" (AdAge) - 30:22 PIZZA PIZZA - 30:38
S1 E43 · Tue, June 11, 2019
Open Source Beyond the Market
This is a lightly edited version of a keynote address Basecamp co-founder and CTO David Heinemeier Hansson delivered at RailsConf 2019 about "open source, markets, debts, purpose, and no less than the meaning of life." David also sits down with Shaun to talk briefly about how he approached this keynote differently than past talks.
S1 E43 · Tue, June 04, 2019
How Buffer Meets Up
Buffer's website - 1:24 Carolyn Kopprasch on Twitter - 1:45 Buffer CEO Joel Gascoigne on Twitter - 11:32 Buffer's Open blog - 22:59 "Remote Team Meetups: Here's What Works For Us" - 23:08
S1 E42 · Tue, May 28, 2019
James Glazebrook at Support Driven Expo Europe 2019
In April, Basecamp Support team member James Glazebrook gave a talk at Support Driven Expo Europe about Everyone On Support. It's an all-hands program where Basecamp employees rotate through a day of working in customer service. James noticed the system—while well-intentioned—wasn't working properly, and set out to fix it. And that, as James himself might say, is pretty metal.
S1 E42 · Tue, May 21, 2019
Rework Mailbag 4
If you have a question you'd like answered on the next Mailbag, leave us a voicemail at (708) 628-7850!
S1 E41 · Tue, May 14, 2019
DHH on The Heartbeat Podcast
To listen to more of The Heartbeat Podcast, visit https://knowyourteam.com/blog/podcast/ or look for the show wherever you listen to podcasts.
S1 E41 · Tue, May 07, 2019
Know Your Team
Claire Lew on Twitter / Know Your Team website — 00:15 The Heartbeat Podcast — 00:34 Know Your Team's "About Us" page — 1:04 "Building Know Your Company" (Signal v. Noise) — 8:04 "How we put together a simple deal to spin off Know Your Company" (Signal v. Noise) — 12:31 "Want to be a better manager? Work as a restaurant hostess" (Know Your Team blog) — 10:55 Daniel Lopes on Twitter — 21:13 The Watercooler — 21:40 "Big news: Know Your Company is now Know Your Team" (Know Your Team blog) — 24:43
S1 E40 · Tue, April 30, 2019
Last Week with Jason Fried: Office Space
We're introducing a new segment called Last Week with Jason Fried, where Basecamp's CEO talks about a task or concern that recently fell on his plate. In this inaugural episode, Jason talks about how the end of the company's lease on its Chicago office leaves him with a big decision on how to design a space for a mostly remote workforce and whether Basecamp needs an office at all. Meanwhile, all work and no play makes Shaun a dull boy.
S1 E40 · Tue, April 23, 2019
Unplugged from the Matrix
Our 2017 episode, "Can You Sell Water? Part 2" - 00:29 The Institute for Justice Clinic on Entrepreneurship at the University of Chicago - 00:37 The study "The Growth, Scope, and Spatial Distribution of People With Felony Records in the United States, 1948–2010" was published in the October 2017 issue of Demography - 3:23 Microsoft made $16,005 in revenues its first year - 5:31 Wikipedia article on ichthys - 9:22 "Care.com Puts Onus on Families to Check Caregivers’ Backgrounds—With Sometimes Tragic Outcomes" (Wall Street Journal, March 2019) - 12:42 "103 Uber drivers accused of sexual assault or abuse" (CNN, April 2018) - 12:44 KENTECH - 12:48
S1 E39 · Thu, April 18, 2019
Job Scam
We're introducing a new segment called Check-Ins, where we talk to folks at Basecamp about their answers to recurring questions that get asked of everyone here. Recently, Jeremy Daer on our Security, Infrastructure, and Performance team dealt with an incident where an Internet scammer was fraudulently posing as a Basecamp recruiter to collect personal information from job seekers. We hear from Jeremy about how this scam works and from Shanae Dykes on Basecamp's Support team about how to keep yourself safe while looking for remote job opportunities.
S1 E39 · Tue, April 09, 2019
Subscription Hostages
The DHH tweet that started it all - 00:36 Wailin's tweet about the Chicago Tribune - 2:23 Laura Hazard Owen on Twitter - 2:55 NiemanLab - 3:34 Consumer Federation of California - 4:21 California Senate Bill 313 , which former Governor Jerry Brown signed into law in 2017 - 5:40 California News Publishers Association - 6:31 The New York Times' cancellation screen - 9:36 The Wall Street Journal's cancellation policy - 9:43 The Washington Post's cancellation policy - 9:57 Pete Mortensen on Twitter - 10:12 Matter Ventures (which shut down in late 2018) - 10:18 Jen Sabella on Twitter - 14:54 Block Club Chicago - 14:59 "Billionaire Owner Shuts Down DNAinfo, Gothamist Sites A Week After Workers Unionize" (NPR) - 15:09
S1 E38 · Tue, March 26, 2019
Did You Order the Code Red?
Read David Heinemeier Hansson's blog post and Jeremy's follow-up post on the mass-login attack. Our episode on the Big Integer outage - 00:41 The big Code Red moment starts at 3:06 of this clip but c'mon, just watch the whole thing - 00:48 Jim Mackenzie on Twitter - 1:15 Background on the data breaches at Marriott , Equifax , and Yahoo - 1:53 Jeremy Daer on Twitter - 2:10 "It's a Unix system!" - 7:24 Have I Been Pwned? - 13:47 1Password , LastPass , Dashlane - 14:52 "Clever girl" - 17:24 "I've got the same combination on my luggage!" - 17:29
S1 E37 · Tue, March 19, 2019
BONUS - Ruby on Rails
In 2004, Basecamp CTO David Heinemeier Hansson released a framework called Ruby on Rails that has since been used by over 1.2 million web applications including Twitter, Airbnb, Hulu, and, of course, Basecamp. In this bonus episode of Rework, David talks about creativity, finding a passion, and how writing Ruby changed the way he thinks about programming.
S1 E37 · Tue, March 12, 2019
Hiring Is Not Hazing
Hello, Mallory - 00:20 The Baby-Sitters Club - 00:40 Aja Hammerly's website - 2:18 Aja's post, "There Is No Perfect Interview" - 2:22 Aja's tweets on hiring from November 2018 - 7:24 A blog post by Basecamp CEO Jason Fried that talks about design challenges - 14:20 Aja on Twitter - 23:15 For further reading from Basecamp on this topic, Jim Mackenzie on the Support team has written some great Signal v. Noise posts about hiring: "Interview or Interrogation?" and "Under Pressure"
S1 E36 · Tue, February 26, 2019
Remote Work: Extreme Edition
The IceCube website - 00:46 What is a neutrino? (Scientific American) - 1:13 SNOLAB in Canada is an example of a neutrino observatory located in an old mine - 1:58 When neutrinos collide with other particles, a blue light is emitted. This is what IceCube detects. Read more about this blue light and IceCube in this article from the National Science Foundation - 2:13 Emsisoft - 2:48 Skynet satellite (and the other Skynet ) - 4:38 Mt. Erebus in Antarctica is the southernmost active volcano on the planet - 14:00 The Thing (the 1982 version by John Carpenter) - 19:28 The IceCube website has an entire section about living at the South Pole - 26:53 The defibrillator scene in The Thing (Warning: VERY SCARY! And gross!) - 27:39 The blood test scene in The Thing (Warning: ALSO VERY SCARY AND GROSS) - 27:50
S1 E35 · Tue, February 12, 2019
No Hard Feelings
"Happy Pacifists," our episode about violent rhetoric (and its opposite) in business - 00:24 "Big Integer," our episode about how Basecamp managed a major outage - 00:30 "Spark Joy with DHH," our episode about applying Marie Kondo's tidying-up principles to business - 00:38 Liz Fosslien's website . Mollie West Duffy's website. Their joint website . - 1:22 No Hard Feelings: The Secret Power of Embracing Emotions At Work - 1:28 IDEO - 1:54 Humu - 2:08 Gretchen Rubin - 12:09 The Shultz Hour , named after former Secretary of State George Shultz - 19:25 Liz and Mollie on Instagram - 35:42 The Book Table - 36:00 "Independent Women," the episode of our previous podcast about Women & Children First bookstore - 36:03
S1 E34 · Tue, January 29, 2019
Reblog
Signal v. Noise - 1:49 Episode 01, "Sell Your By-products" - 2:00 "Signal v. Noise moves to Medium" - 2:37 Jason Fried and Adam Stoddard - 2:48 Medium's changed policy on custom domains - 3:55 Medium's membership program - 6:10 A Vox article on how Tumblr's ban on adult content negatively affects the broader community - 7:30 History of WordPress - 9:55 A Quartz article on how WordPress employees work remotely - 10:03 Matt Mullenweg , founder of WordPress - 10:15 "Medium has been great for us" - 15:51 An Atlantic article about seasonally attired porch geese - 20:00
S1 E35 · Tue, January 22, 2019
BONUS - Spark Joy with DHH
Marie Kondo’s official website - 00:14 Marie Kondo's interpreter is Marie Iida and here's a Quartz interview with her - 00:28 Author Courtney Milan's Twitter thread on Marie Kondo's misunderstood advice about books - 00:49 Everything Wailin learned about arguing on social media she learned from DHH in the "Pick A Fight" episode of Rework - 1:00 The Life Changing-Magic of Tidying Up - 1:12 Extreme Programming Explained by Kent Beck - 6:42 The history of the We Work Remotely job board is written up in the last entry of this page of the Basecamp handbook - 9:06 Basecamp decided to sunset Highrise in 2018. Read Jason's note on the Highrise website - 9:32
S1 E33 · Tue, January 15, 2019
Big Integer
On Thursday, November 8, Basecamp 3 went down for almost five hours. It was the worst outage to hit the company in a decade and a stress test of Basecamp's practices around internal communication, customer support, and calm work. Today's episode goes inside the company on November 8 to see how the outage unfolded. Show Notes Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson's most recent book, It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work - 1:41 Basecamp's Support team - 6:03 Basecamp's Status page - 6:40 DHH's timeline from November 8 and his post-mortem , published on Signal v. Noise - 6:46 Our episode on "How to Say You're Sorry" - 15:57
S1 E34 · Tue, January 01, 2019
BONUS - Happy New Year
We tried to record an episode, but there were more important things to talk about. See you in 2019 with more episodes of REWORK.
S1 E33 · Fri, December 21, 2018
BONUS - 100% Facebook-Free
After yet another round of revelations about Facebook's use of customer data, Basecamp has decided to become 100% Facebook-free . We've actually been off Facebook proper for a while, but on Wednesday we decided to remove the company from Instagram and WhatsApp as well. This is a conversation with Basecamp's CTO, David Heinemeier Hansson, about making that decision and why he thinks you should follow in Basecamp's footsteps.
S1 E32 · Wed, December 19, 2018
BONUS - Rename
On the last episode of Rework, we talked about the dangers of using violent language in a business context. We've had to grapple with other kinds of problematic language at Basecamp as well. In this mini bonus episode, Shaun talks to programmer Jeremy Daer about shedding harmful terms for database relationships that persist in the industry.
S1 E32 · Tue, December 18, 2018
Happy Pacifists
The Brigham Young/Utah "Holy War" game is so famous it gets its own Wikipedia entry - 00:03 Steve Jobs' quote about going "thermonuclear" against Android was first revealed in Walter Isaacson's biography - 1:18 Joshua Gubler's website - 1:49 David Wood's website - 1:57 Joshua Gubler and David's research, conducted with Nathan Kalmoe of George Washington University, was published in the Journal of Business Ethics in September 2015 - 3:20 Planet Money did a story about The Art of War's popularity in business culture - 9:33 If you have anxiety about late-stage capitalism like Wailin does, you should read this article by Alexis Madrigal - 11:08 The Center for Nonviolent Communication - 13:07 Check out Elizabeth's previous appearance on Rework - 13:25
S1 E31 · Tue, December 04, 2018
Sometimes It's Crazy At Work
Books by Basecamp - 00:18 Harper Business - 3:52 Adam Stoddard , Basecamp's marketing designer and the designer of the new book's cover - 4:01 Jason Zimdars , Basecamp designer and book illustrator - 5:26 Mike Rohde , the illustrator for Rework and Remote - 5:45 Charles Darwin on Daily Routines , a blog that became the book Daily Rituals: How Artists Work, edited by Mason Currey . The book was an important reference for the illustrations. - 7:05 Jason Zimdars' Signal v. Noise post on how he illustrated the new book - 18:20 You can watch the entire pilot of Small Wonder on YouTube, or you can be like Shaun and staunchly refuse because you find the entire thing creepy, which is also fair. - 10:20 The Economist review of the book (you might hit a paywall) - 13:49 Blade Runner 2049 baseline test - 25:55 You can read David's write-up of the book launch debacle on Signal v. Noise .
S1 E30 · Tue, November 20, 2018
The Worst Performance Review
Rachel Ernst , VP of employee success at Reflektive - 00:41 Reflektive’s #MyWorstPerformanceReview contest and the winners - 2:12 Basecamp CTO David Heinemeier Hansson’s classic screed against fundraising and startup culture - 7:00 Reflektive’s press release on its $60M Series C - 7:32 Watch a real-life design review with Conor and Basecamp CEO Jason Fried - 13:46 Hey, did you know we at Basecamp haaaaaaate meetings with the fire of a thousand suns? - 19:24 Ralph Vaughan Williams Symphony No. 3 (Pastoral), 4th Movement - 26:00
S1 E29 · Tue, November 06, 2018
Rework Mailbag 3
Behold the wonder of raclette - 00:59 Looking for a calm company while job searching - 2:33 How a business that deals with clients can work more calmly - 4:24 The 37signals manifesto - 6:03 Applying calm principles in a school setting - 8:40 The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention say most schools start too early - 10:24 Alfie Kohn’s website . DHH recommends Punished by Rewards and The Myth of the Spoiled Child - 11:50 How to start a calm company when there’s limited runway - 13:51 Listen to our previous episode, “You Need Less Than You Think“ - 16:11 How Basecamp recovers from periods of non-calm - 19:05 Healthy ways for co-founders or partners to disagree - 22:56 J.P. Graziano , the Italian sub shop where Shaun buys lunch almost every day. We also featured the business on this episode of our previous podcast. - 28:19
S1 E28 · Tue, October 23, 2018
The Myth of the Overnight Sensation
Our previous episode - 0:11 It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work by Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson - 0:19 Rework by Jason Fried and DHH - 0:37 The story of Squatty Potty - 1:13 This Unicorn Changed the Way I Poop , the original viral video - 1:28
S1 E27 · Tue, October 16, 2018
It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work - Part 2
We’re taking your questions for David and Jason to answer in an upcoming mailbag episode! Leave us a voicemail at (708) 628-7850 and you'll be entered into a drawing for an autographed copy of It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work. Listen to the first part of this interview - 0:23 Jason and David’s previous books are Rework and Remote - 3:37 Jason and David will be speaking at the Wall Street Journal's one-day Future of Work conference in New York on October 17 (check out their official WSJ stipple portraits!) - 6:50
S1 E27 · Tue, October 09, 2018
It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work - Part 1
We’re taking your questions for David and Jason to answer in an upcoming mailbag episode! Leave us a voicemail at (708) 628-7850 and you'll be entered into a drawing for an autographed copy of It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work. It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work - 1:05 Jason and David’s previous books were Rework and Remote - 1:12 Check out our previous mailbag episodes, here , here , and here - 1:55 ”Marissa Mayer: You, Too, Can Work 130 Hours a Week If You Plan When to Take a Shit“ (GIzmodo) - 7:53 The quotation ”It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it“ is attributed to Upton Sinclair - 9:12 Basecamp’s policies on vacation time and summer hours can be found in the company handbook - 15:56 Work Can Wait - 19:57
S1 E26 · Tue, September 25, 2018
Farewell, Noah
"Thanks, Basecamp, for the memories and the lessons" on Medium Noah Lorang on Twitter - 00:40 Noah's post on Reddit - 6:47 "Convert Geological Info into a Custom Map for 3D Printing and Milling" in Make: magazine - 7:23 Rick and Morty - 9:34 "Can it be 'art' if it's made with a robot's help?" on Medium - 24:45 Elevated Woodworking website / Instagram / Facebook / Twitter - 28:24
S1 E25 · Tue, September 11, 2018
The Bean Machine
Take A Break , our last regular episode before sabbatical - 2:47 Why we only work 4 days a week during summer (Signal v. Noise) - 3:02 Carcassonne in southern France is a UNESCO World Heritage site - 4:11 It is also a board game that Shaun enjoys! - 4:14 Wailin thought she discovered Aperol spritzes in Europe but it turns out she was just brainwashed by a liquor brand and has no original ideas or tastes of her own. She still likes to drink Aperol spritzes. - 4:36 All about the viol da gamba - 4:58 It Doesn't Have to be Crazy at Work , due out October 2 - 5:38 The Bean Machine on Twitter , Facebook , and Instagram - 6:53
S1 E25 · Tue, August 21, 2018
BONUS - The Distance - The Business Cycle
Shaun and Wailin are still on vacation, but we have another of our favorite episodes from our previous podcast, The Distance , which was about long-running businesses. Wailin's pick is this story of America's last bicycle manufacturer.
S1 E24 · Tue, August 07, 2018
BONUS - The Distance - Diamonds Are Forever
Shaun and Wailin are on vacation! During our hiatus, we're bringing you our favorite stories from our previous podcast, The Distance , which was about long-running businesses. Shaun's pick is this story of a 90-year-old jewelry store and how running a business can be a true labor of love.
S1 E24 · Tue, July 24, 2018
Take a Break
Rework made its podcast debut with an episode called "Sell Your By-products" in August 2017 — 00:37 A list of employee benefits at Basecamp — 00:51 Adeline Koh is the founder of Sabbatical Beauty and you'll also find her in the company's very friendly and welcoming Facebook group — 1:45 Adeline's essay on starting a business while on academic sabbatical —1:59 A primer on Korean beauty — 4:20 Jason Fried — 14:08 Jason and DHH 's upcoming book about calm company practices — 16:19 Soapwalla — 23:01 Rachel Winard's original cleanser and moisturizer are still sold today — 24:13 Rachel's blog post about taking sabbatical — 24:34
S1 E23 · Tue, July 17, 2018
BONUS - Out in the Open
In a bonus conversation with Sarah Park of MeetEdgar, she talks about making the company handbook public and why they have a policy of opening up meetings and conversations to everyone.
S1 E23 · Tue, July 10, 2018
Temperature Check
One of our colleagues on the Basecamp customer support team, Jayne Ogilvie, wanted to find out how other tech companies with remote staffs handle issues like communication, career development, and hiring. Jayne sent out a survey and got back a wealth of information and ideas about how other teams work together. In this episode, we hear more from two participating companies: Sarah Park of MeetEdgar talks about how their staff gathers internal feedback on important decisions, and Patrick Filler and Anitra St. Hilaire of Harvest talk about taking on the challenge of making their company more diverse and inclusive.
S1 E22 · Tue, June 26, 2018
Go Behind the Scenes
A famous guy once said, "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!" But he was a grifter. In fact, going behind the scenes—whether it's a factory tour or cooking show—can be a valuable experience for both visitors and guides. In this episode, we crash a middle school field trip to the Method soap factory on Chicago's South Side. We also hear from Basecamp's CEO Jason Fried on his YouTube series on making design decisions and from the managing partners of Zingerman's Bakehouse in Ann Arbor, Michigan on why they don't believe in secrets.
S1 E21 · Tue, June 12, 2018
You Need Less Than You Think
Who needs a fancy office when you can work out of a dingy food court? Who needs fancy equipment when you can buy what you need at Walmart? Who needs to hire an SEO specialist? What does an SEO specialist do, anyway? (A question for another episode, or maybe another podcast altogether.) On this episode, three very different companies—a fashion brand, a company that sells fresh salads from vending machines, and an auto detailing shop—discuss their humble beginnings and offer practical advice about being resourceful and staying lean.
S1 E20 · Tue, May 29, 2018
But Wait, There's More!
Do you struggle with finding the right podcast? Are you tired of true crime shows and hosts trying to sell you a mattress? Introducing Rework, a podcast that's free of both murder and midroll ads. When you listen to this episode of Rework, you'll learn the fascinating history of infomercials and hear sales tips from experts like the marketing guru who made the Thighmaster a '90s sensation. But wait, there's more! Stick around after the episode to hear Wailin explain the premise of Three's Company to Shaun. Subscribe to Rework today!
S1 E19 · Tue, May 15, 2018
Rework Mailbag 2
Alison Green of Ask A Manager , whom we featured in our previous episode , gives her advice on a couple of questions too. Topics covered: Communicating changes in a corporate culture when the workforce is remote (0:40) Being transparent about why a change is made when the news is unequivocally negative (3:25) Setting up a system where conflicts and problems can be escalated and resolved (9:28) Managing feelings of loneliness and isolation as a remote worker (12:15) If you'd like to submit a question for Jason and David to answer on a future mailbag episode, call us at (708) 628-7850 or email us at hello@rework.fm.
S1 E18 · Tue, May 01, 2018
Ask A Manager
Alison's new book, Ask A Manager Ask A Manager's Twitter Ask A Manager podcast Alison's crossover episode on the Captain Awkward podcast How can I recover from being embarrassingly drunk at a work event? My employee sent a memo to management about ghosts in the building An employee is putting magical curses on her coworkers I ghosted my ex, and she's about to be my new boss Update on the ghosting ex
S1 E18 · Tue, April 17, 2018
BONUS - Culturati Summit 2018
A video of this discussion is also available. We're still taking your calls for an upcoming mailbag episode where Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson will answer your questions about workplace communication. We're also bringing in a special guest, Alison Green of Ask A Manager , to give advice! Call us at (708) 628-7850 or email us at hello@rework.fm. Further Reading: Dean Carter on Patagonia's family-affirming policies . The President Stole Your Land , Patagonia's campaign against the Trump administration's move to shrink Bears Ears National Monument and Grand Staircase-Escalante in Utah. 2016 article in Outside about Patagonia donating all of its Black Friday sales to environmental groups. The Obama Foundation's 2018 Fellows . Culturati Summit . The Culture Book , Culturati's "practical guide to building incredible company cultures."
S1 E17 · Tue, April 10, 2018
BONUS - When Chris Met Mark
Chris Ruder, the CEO of Spikeball, shares a story about meeting Shark Tank investor Mark Cuban at a bar and committing a photo faux pas (a faux-to pas?), a year before he taped his Shark Tank appearance.
S1 E17 · Tue, April 03, 2018
Life After Shark Tank
This episode features: Melissa Butler of The Lip Bar , a company that makes vegan and cruelty-free lipstick in vibrant shades that work on a broad range of skin tones. Watch a clip of their episode. Chris Ruder of Spikeball , the maker of a game that's a mix of volleyball and four square. Ruder played Spikeball as a child and later revived the brand after it had become obsolete. Joe Moore of First Defense Nasal Screens , which patented an adhesive filter that sticks on top of the nostrils to prevent allergens from entering the body. A friendly reminder that we are collecting your workplace communication questions for Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson. If you're seeking advice on how to talk to your boss, your employee, or a colleague, leave us a voicemail at (708) 628-7850 or email us at hello@rework.fm.
S1 E16 · Tue, March 20, 2018
How to Say You're Sorry
"You know I try, but I don't do too well with apologies," Justin Bieber once sang. You're not the only one with this problem, Justin! Why is saying sorry so difficult, especially for businesses? In this episode: A veteran tracker of apologies looks at what's changed (and what hasn't) in public apology culture; Basecamp co-founder David Heinemeier Hansson recounts a time when the company had to say sorry; and two founders make a product to help tech companies apologize to their customers.
S1 E15 · Tue, March 13, 2018
Update: Please Don't Like This
Jason Fried talks about designing an alternative to Basecamp's Applause feature that is subtle yet expressive, and distinct from the kinds of reactions and feedback mechanisms used on social media platforms. (If you missed our previous episode on the debate over the Applause feature, go back and listen!)
S1 E15 · Tue, March 06, 2018
Please Don't Like This
At Basecamp, we're in the midst of a debate over an Applause feature that was designed to improve communication but might be stoking unwanted anxiety. In this episode, CTO David Heinemeier Hansson and iOS designer Tara Mann present different sides of the Applause debate and explore the ways behavior patterns in social media are trickling into the workplace. We also look at how world-famous pianist Glenn Gould challenged norms around performance, audiences, and applause.
S1 E14 · Wed, February 21, 2018
BONUS - Dan Miller on Outsourcing
Dan Miller of Mulberrys Garment Care talks outsourcing, bootstrapping, and growing slowly in some leftover bits we couldn't quite fit into episode 14.
S1 E14 · Tue, February 20, 2018
Meetings Are Toxic
You'll laugh; you'll cry; you'll gnash your teeth in recognition as you hear the stories of horrible meetings we collected for this episode. Meetings are one of the worst kinds of workplace interruptions. They're held too frequently, run too long, and involve more people than necessary. Also in this episode: A Basecamp programmer gives advice on rethinking the culture of meetings and the story of one very cringeworthy meeting with a surprising outcome.
S1 E13 · Tue, February 06, 2018
Interruption is Not Collaboration
Hey, are you busy? Can you listen to this real quick? It's an episode about interruptions in the workplace. You'll hear from academic researchers, Basecamp's head data wrangler, and the CEO of a remote company about how they've tackled not just the disruptions themselves, but also the workplace culture that allows those intrusions to flourish.
S1 E12 · Fri, January 26, 2018
BONUS - Jason Fried On To-Do Notifications
Special bonus episode where Jason Fried discusses some of the thinking that goes into making a very small change to the to-do feature in Basecamp.
S1 E12 · Tue, January 23, 2018
Don't Be Fake
Hey, are you crushing it? It seems like everyone is constantly crushing it in the business world. But maybe it would be better if we were honest about our flaws, talked like ourselves, and aimed to be genuine instead of super polished. In this episode: A Basecamp customer support representative shares tips on writing emails like a real human being; an inherently artificial industry gets a dose of reality; and two startup founders try an experiment in radical transparency to save their business.
S1 E11 · Tue, January 16, 2018
BONUS - The Million Dollar Mistake
For more details, read his blog post about it: https://www.fredperrotta.com/i-fucked-up/
S1 E11 · Tue, January 09, 2018
Start Making Something
New year, new you! If you started 2018 with an idea for a product, business, or creative pursuit, now is the time to start making something. In this episode: A tabletop game designer finds that sometimes, all you need to get going is a pack of index cards and a pencil; a skincare blogger tries her hand at DIY and ends up with a cult hit; and a travel backpack company's first attempt at making something goes comically awry.
S1 E10 · Tue, December 26, 2017
Rework Mailbag 1 - Part 2
If you'd like your questions answered on a future mailbag episode leave a message at 708.628.7850.
S1 E10 · Tue, December 19, 2017
Rework Mailbag 1 - Part 1
If you'd like your questions answered on a future mailbag episode, leave us a message at 708-628-7850.
S1 E9 · Tue, December 05, 2017
Planning is Guessing
Basecamp's founders never wrote a business plan when they started the company. Even today, they don't like to look too far ahead. Too much long-term planning can hamper your ability to react to the present. Did you have plans to listen to this episode later? Be spontaneous and listen now! You'll hear from a seasoned investor on how he came to run one of the oldest vinyl record pressing plants in the U.S.; Basecamp CEO Jason Fried on working in six-week cycles; and an independent toy store owner on surviving the holidays without giving into fads.
S1 E8 · Tue, November 21, 2017
Can You Sell Water? Part 2
Some of the tech industry's most vaunted companies revel in their origins as mavericks or rule-breakers, having flouted regulations in the name of disruption. That kind of risk-taking is celebrated in Silicon Valley but punished in other places, most notably minority communities. In this episode: A legal advocate for low-income entrepreneurs talks about the hurdles her clients face, and a husband-and-wife team of street food vendors share what they've learned making the transition from the informal to the formal economy.
S1 E7 · Wed, November 08, 2017
BONUS - The Price of Basecamp's Water
Some leftover bits that didn't make it into the last episode.
S1 E7 · Tue, November 07, 2017
Can You Sell Water? Part 1
Selling is a core skill. You have to know how to sell, whether it's a product, an idea, or yourself. In 2012, Basecamp CEO Jason Fried saw the results of a bottled water-selling challenge at Techstars Chicago, a bootcamp program for startups. That one-day competition is the starting point for a conversation that includes the art of negotiation, Jason's experiences selling knives, tennis rackets, and software; and other adventures in business.
S1 E6 · Tue, October 31, 2017
BONUS - Jason Fried at INDUSTRY 2017
Basecamp CEO Jason Fried talks about ideas with Paul McAvinchey, co-founder of Product Collective, at INDUSTRY: The Product Conference in September 2017.
S1 E6 · Tue, October 24, 2017
The Moral ABC
Dr. Bronner's Magic Soaps, which bills itself as the top-selling natural soapmaker in North America, wasn't founded to sell soap. The company was started to promote a religious philosophy developed by Emanuel Bronner, a third-generation German Jewish soapmaker, who printed his message on the labels of his potent peppermint liquid soap. Successive generations of the Bronner family have used the label's message of a united humanity to guide the company, which spends much of its profits on charitable causes and is outspoken on issues like wage equality and fair trade. Today, even as the idea of a united humanity seems more distant than ever, Dr. Bronner's continues to spread its soap and message worldwide.
S1 E5 · Tue, October 10, 2017
Take A Stand
Business and politics tend to make uneasy bedfellows, but in these divisive times, even businesses that have historically stayed out of hot-button issues are coming off the sidelines. In this episode: An online florist tells racists to shop elsewhere; Basecamp stops reimbursing employees for Uber rides; and a Chicago couple creates a lighthearted product with a serious message about the treatment of female bodies.
S1 E4 · Tue, September 26, 2017
Say No
It's easy to say yes, whether it's to a customer request or a deadline from your boss. But saying yes too many times can result in an unmanageable workload or distract you from the stuff you really want to be doing. It's good to practice saying no and setting boundaries. In this episode: A personal organizer helps her clients say no to physical clutter; a programmer at Basecamp peers into the abyss of burnout and steps back just in time; and a healthy meal-planning startup rejects complexity, even if it means letting some customers go.
S1 E3 · Tue, September 12, 2017
Pick A Fight (on Twitter)
Basecamp CTO David Heinemeier Hansson is known for many things, including creating Ruby on Rails and writing business books. He also has a knack for arguing with people on the Internet. This cheerfully profane conversation explores how Twitter is like a virtual pillow to scream into and the role that extreme voices play in moving important conversations forward. We also relive some of David's memorable Twitter melees, including the one that got him blocked by Paul Graham.
S1 E2 · Tue, August 29, 2017
Workaholics Aren't Heroes
Being tired isn't a badge of honor. There, we said it. We've been saying this for a while now, because our culture loves to glorify toiling long hours for its own sake and we think that leads to subpar work and general misery. In this episode, we talk to a veteran of the video game industry and a member of Basecamp's customer support team about workaholism and burnout. We also hear from a new business owner who's balancing mindfulness with the demands of starting her own meditation-focused company.
S1 E1 · Tue, August 15, 2017
Sell Your By-products
Welcome to the first episode of Rework! This podcast is based on Jason Fried and David Heinemeier Hansson's 2010 best-selling business book, which was itself based on years of blogging. So what better way to kick off this show than talking about byproducts? In this episode, Jason explains how Basecamp's ideas have been packaged as blog posts, workshops, and books. We also visit a 145-year-old sawmill in Ontario, Canada to see how this family-owned business sells its physical byproducts.
S1 E1 · Wed, July 26, 2017
Rework Teaser
"The word you always hear is 'scaling,' right? 'We gotta scale.' And I'm just like: well, why do you have to scale?" – Jason Fried Introducing the Rework podcast: a show by the makers of Basecamp about a better way to work and run your business. For years entrepreneurs have been told that to be successful they have to scale fast, raise money and get big. We're here to tell you there's a better way.
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