No Such Thing as Normal
At least 20% of New Zealanders are believed to be neurodivergent, but there is very little awareness, understanding and support for people with conditions such as ADHD, Autism and Dyslexia. Sonia Gray has a neurodivergent daughter and is an ADHDer herself. In this 10-part series she’ll talk to dozens of experts and people with a lived-experience of neurodiversity to better understand how we can support and celebrate those whose brains are wired differently. No Such Thing as Normal is brought to you by NZ Herald and Team Uniform, with support from NZ on Air and launches June 10th. New episodes ar...
S2 E13 · Fri, November 01, 2024
Episode 23: The mystery of Tourette’s syndrome
We all know what Tourette’s is - or we think we do. But this is a condition that is largely misunderstood and routinely misrepresented. Only around 10% of those with Tourette’s syndrome have the ‘swearing tic’ - coprolalia. But the other vocal and motor tics can be just as debilitating. In this episode, Sonia speaks to Tiktok sensation, Leighton Clarke - aka Uncle Tics. He now embraces his Tourette’s and encourages others to do the same. We also hear from Fyfe, a bubbly and creative 10-year-old. Her mother Amanda describes Fyfe’s journey - from the occasional tic, to a diagnosis of Tourette’s syndrome. And clinical psychologist, Hilary Mack, talks about the connection between Tourette’s Syndrome, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and ADHD. Guests: Leighton Clarke (Uncle Tics) Tiktok Fyfe and Amanda Hilary Mack Hilary Mack Psychology Resources: Tourette’s Association of NZ Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E12 · Fri, October 25, 2024
Episode 22: The Spiral of Shame
A diagnosis of ADHD, autism or dyslexia is merely an indication that your brain works in a different - and exciting - way. So why are the rates of co-occurring anxiety and depression so high for neurodivergent people? In this episode, Sonia talks to 16-year-old Emily Martin, who has ADHD, dyslexia and dyscalculia. Emily suffered from intense anxiety and low self-esteem throughout her primary school years. Therapist Jane Kjersten explains the specific type of trauma that can come from feeling ‘lesser than’, and suggests ways to heal from the emotional pain. Guests: Emily and Jo Martin Jane Kjersten Jane Kjersten Therapist Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E11 · Fri, October 18, 2024
Episode 21: What is Dyspraxia?
Dyspraxia (or Developmental Coordination Disorder) is more than just a difficulty tying shoelaces or riding a bike. It impacts almost every aspect of life, and the effort to carry out basic tasks can be exhausting. Sonia talks to Bayley Garnham, a 24 year old Personal Trainer, who has dyspraxia and dysgraphia. Dyspraxic kids often give up on sports early, but Bayley wants to change that. He believes these kids need a different approach to learning sports. And Sensory Integration Practitioner, Elen Nathan, explains what dyspraxia/DCD is - and what’s going on inside the minds of those with this ‘hidden’ condition. Guests: Bayley Garnham bayley garnham – personal trainer Elen Nathan The Playful Place Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast Resources: Dyspraxia NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E10 · Fri, October 11, 2024
Episode 20: The Shaming and Blaming of Parents
The parents of kids with neurodifferences face multiple challenges. But while navigating a broken system is exhausting, the constant scrutiny of your parenting can be worse. In this episode, Sonia talks to TVNZ’s 1News at 6 presenter, Melissa Stokes and Newstalk ZB Host, Francesca Rudkin about advocating for their children. And researcher Willow Sainsbury, explains why the go-to suggestion of ‘parenting courses’ can be so distressing for parents. Guests: Melissa Stokes Francesca Rudkin Willow Sainsbury Research Study on Parent's Experiences Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast Resources: Online Every Day with ADHD Parenting Evening Course Programmes Archive - Autism NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E9 · Fri, October 04, 2024
Episode 19: A PhD in Parenting - raising a neurodivergent child
Parenting a neurodivergent child is wonderful, but it’s challenging. Often, it can feel like the only people who understand are other parents on the same road. In this episode, Sonia talks to Francesca Rudkin, who had to navigate life with a daughter in crisis, before ADHD was identified. We meet members of the ‘Dad’s Autism Support Group’ in Auckland who all have kids with high-needs on the autism spectrum. They say connecting with each other regularly, and sharing the highs - and the lows - has been invaluable. And educational psychologist, Willow Sainsbury, talks about the experience for parents getting a diagnosis and support. The main theme of her research study was ‘the battle’. Guests: Francesca Rudkin Peter, Mac, Noah and Gareth from the Dad’s Autism Support Group Willow Sainsbury Research Study on Parent's Experiences Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E8 · Fri, September 27, 2024
Episode 18: The Fork In The Road
The rates of ADHD and dyslexia in prisons is staggering. But these same neurotypes are also more likely to be successful CEO’s and entrepreneurs. So where is the fork in the road? What leads someone down the wrong path? Sonia Gray talks to Ricky Wakelin, a kind and gentle father-of-two. In the early 2000’s Ricky’s life had spiralled out of control. He was addicted to hard drugs and was eventually incarcerated for armed robbery. Three years ago, an assessment confirmed that Ricky has ADHD. The diagnosis has helped him understand the reasons behind his lifelong struggle with things like emotional regulation and hypersensitivity. Sonia also talks to forensic psychologist Anton Ashcroft, who explains why those with ADHD are often drawn to illicit substances. He talks about the value of connection, and why this - rather than tougher consequences - is so important for the rehabilitation of offenders. Guests: Ricky Wakelin Anton Ashcroft - Forensic Psychologist Resources: ADHD NZ Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E7 · Fri, September 13, 2024
Episode 17: Autism - inside the non-speaking world
It’s very difficult to get by in society when you don’t use words to communicate. Non-speaking autistic people tend to be invisible, unless they are ‘causing a problem’. Olympic rower Eric Murray is father to 12 year-old Zac, who is autistic and ADHD. He talks to Sonia Gray about the challenges, the joys and the desperate need for support and understanding. Guests: Eric Murray Anna Middleton - Senior Behaviour Specialist - Explore Services Resources: Autism NZ https://autismnz.org.nz Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E6 · Fri, September 06, 2024
Episode 16: Autism - Removing the Mask
Many autistic people have spent their lives masking, but it’s an exhausting and inauthentic way to live. Now, as understanding around neurodivergence grows, many autistics are choosing to ‘unmask’ and embrace their differences. Autistic comedian Abby Howells has found success as her authentic, ‘unmasked’ self on stage. The things she used to hate about herself are now working for her. And she wants to encourage other autistic people to lean into who they truly are. Guests: Abby Howells Instagram Dr Sarah Watson Totally Psyched Instagram - No Such Thing as Normal Podcast See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E5 · Fri, August 30, 2024
Episode 15: Dyslexia - A 'specialisation', not a disorder
In this episode Sonia Gray finds out how vital people with dyslexia are to the survival of the human race - they're the explorers, creative thinkers and problem solvers. She talks to poet and playwright, Dominic Hoey, who has written award-winning books, despite his reading challenges. And dyslexic researcher and champion, Dr Ruth Gibbons, talks about the importance of movement for dyslexics. GUESTS: Dr Ruth Gibbons - Massey University Social Anthropology lecturer Dominic Hoey - Writer Oliver and Amy Williams RESOURCES: The Dyslexia Foundation of NZ SPELD Learn To Write Good See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E4 · Fri, August 23, 2024
Episode 14: Dyslexia - Are we getting it all wrong?
Dyslexia has long been thought of as that thing that makes it hard to read - and people are often made to feel dumb because of it. But we're learning more and more that reading and writing isn't really an issue. In fact some dyslexics read brilliantly - before they even start school - it's just once they're in the classroom they're lost and left behind in a curriculum that doesn't work for them. In this episode Sonia Gray finds out about how schools are failing our dyslexic kids, and how the trauma of education is deep-rooted right into adulthood. She speaks to Michael McWilliams who found school a nightmare, dropped out at 15, then turned his life around. And dyslexic researcher and champion, Dr Ruth Gibbons, who talks about the amazing strengths of the dyslexic mind. GUESTS: Dr Ruth Gibbons - Massey University Social Anthropology lecturer Michael McWilliams - 23-year-old entrepreuner Jane Kjersten - Michael's mother See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Thu, August 01, 2024
Season 2 Update
No Such Thing as Normal is taking a short break, but Season 2 will return from August 24th. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E3 · Fri, July 19, 2024
Episode 13: AuDHD - When Autism meets ADHD
WARNING: This episode does contain explicit language Autism and ADHD were always thought of as mutually exclusive conditions, but in recent years it’s become possible to get a diagnosis of both. Now, more and more people are recognising they have traits of both autism and ADHD, commonly known as ‘AuDHD’. But because of the opposing nature of these neurotypes, ‘AuDHD’ can feel like an internal ‘tug-of war’. In this episode Sonia Gray speaks to Rich Rowley and Annabelle March, who describe their lived-experience as AuDHDers. And Clinical Psychologist Sarah Watson, talks about the challenges, and strengths that come with these unique minds. GUESTS: Dr Sarah Watson, Clinical Psychologist, Totally Psyched Rich Rowley Annabelle March See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E2 · Fri, July 12, 2024
Episode 12: Adult ADHD - Is it more than just always losing your keys?
WARNING: This episode does contain explicit language There’s been a sharp rise in the number of adults seeking ADHD assessments, and for many a diagnosis can be the answer to a lifetime of struggle. Musician Anika Moa was diagnosed with ADHD a few years ago. She tells Sonia Gray about the mental health battles she’s endured, and the positive changes a diagnosis has made to her life. And ADHD coach, Alex Campbell says that ADHD is about much more than focus and attention. He explains how Executive Functions work and says the key factor is that ADHD brains are driven by interest, not importance. Guests: Anika Moa Alex Campbell, ADHD Coach Resources: VIA Character Strengths The six cluster of Executive Functions ADHD NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S2 E1 · Fri, July 05, 2024
Episode 11: Sensory Challenges - when you feel too much
The whirr of an air conditioner; the feeling of socks on your feet; the sound of other people breathing: Sensory challenges are arbitrary, but they can cause acute distress. In this episode, host Sonia Gray talks to three guests who experience the world in BOLD And Sensory Integration Specialist, Elen Nathan, unpacks what’s happening in the eight sensory systems, and how we can best support those who have sensory sensitivities. She also explains why chicken nuggets are the one food most kids can eat. GUESTS: Elen Nathan, Occupational Therapist, The Playful Place Amber-Rose Nikolas Bec Annabelle See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Trailer · Wed, July 03, 2024
Trailer - Season 2 coming soon!
Season Two of the award-winning No Such Thing as Normal returns from July 6th across NZ Herald, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E10 · Fri, August 11, 2023
Episode 10: A Broader Definition of Normal
OCD is largely thought of as an aversion to germs and excessive hand washing, but it’s far more complicated than that. Obsessive thoughts can be around almost anything, and the compulsive behaviour that accompanies it can be debilitating for the individual and their whānau. Up to 80 000 New Zealanders live with OCD but less than 10% have sought treatment. In this final episode of the series, Sonia talks to 17-year-old Poppy, who gives a brave insight into her OCD. And we hear from some of the many people and groups who are driving change in the neurodiversity space. Guests: Poppy Armiger Helena Armiger Jock Matthews Rojolie Clinic Professor David Coghill AADPA Darrin Bull Jo Charman Autism NZ Tanya Blakey Autism NZ Susan Haldane Mind Over Manner Rich Rowley Brain Badge Facebook: Kids Wired Differently Instagram: nosuchthingasnormalpodcast Resources OCD: OCD NZ Fixate Facebook Group Other Resources: ADHD NZ Autism NZ Dyslexia NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E9 · Fri, August 04, 2023
Episode 9: Rethinking Dyslexia
Dyslexia is still thought of a problem with reading and writing but that’s just a small part of the picture; those who are dyslexic experience the world in a completely different way. This episode looks at some of the lesser-known dyslexic characteristics, the best ways to support dyslexic learners and we look at how ‘shame’ is such a huge issue for those who learn differently. Documentary: Unlocking Potential Guests: Kimberley Crossman Dr Ruth Gibbons www.ruth-gibbons.com Vanessa Victor Remarkable Minds Helen Armiger Ruby Armiger Elliot Jones Unlocking Potential See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E8 · Fri, July 28, 2023
Episode 8: The Mechanics of a Meltdown
Neurodivergent people respond to the environment in unique ways. Occasionally, if their nervous systems are overwhelmed, the body responds by going into a meltdown. Sensory overload, communication challenges and sensitivity to demands can all contribute to this temporary loss of control of behaviour. We’re often quick to judge the behaviour we’re seeing, but this is just the tip of the iceberg. In this episode Sonia talks to a dad who has radically changed his parenting style to support his ADHD/Autistic children. And we hear from neurodivergent people about what causes a meltdown and what the experience feels like for them. Guests: Rob Newlove Parenting Unique Children Sophie Newlove Matt Frost Nick Marsh Lucy Charles Paediatric OT Dani Sharyn Gousmett Willow Corner See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E7 · Fri, July 21, 2023
Episode 7: How ADHD hides in women and girls
Although we think of ADHD as being a mostly male condition, it is just as prevalent in females. However, the diagnosis rates tell a different story - females are less than half as likely to be identified as having this neurological condition. Women tend to be better at suppressing and internalising their emotions. But things like Rejection Sensitivity Disorder, intolerance to boredom, poor executive function and time blindness are very real, and they can significantly impact an individual’s quality of life. In this episode, we look at ways we can work with the ADHD brain - rather than against it - by identifying the many strengths of ADHD. And Sonia chats to broadcaster Hayley Holt about her experience as a late-diagnosed ADHDer. Guests: Dr. Sarah Watson Totally Psyched Hayley Holt David Coghill AADPA Rich Rowley Brain Badge Alex Campbell Resources: ADHD NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E6 · Fri, July 14, 2023
Episode 6: Education (Part 2)
In this episode we continue looking at whether our education system is meeting the needs of neurodivergent children. We ask: What are the supports and accommodations available? Do you need an official diagnosis of dyslexia to qualify for a reader/writer? And why are stand downs and exclusions so common for kids who are autistic or ADHD? Facebook: Kids Wired Differently Guests: Rachel King and Theo Pippa Biggs Include Me - Specialist Education Services Tom Little Pukare Cards Anna Coleman Helen McDonald See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E5 · Fri, July 07, 2023
Episode 5: Education (Part 1)
In Aotearoa, we pride ourselves on our inclusive education system. But is that really the experience for kids who are Autistic, ADHD, Dyslexic or Gifted? Over two episodes we ask: Is our education system really meeting the needs of neurodivergent children, their families and the teachers that support them? Sonia talks to students, parents and specialist teachers about their experiences in the education system, and what they think works best for children who learn differently. Facebook: Kids Wired Differently Guests: Rich Rowley brainbadge.org Maximiliano Pierret Massey University Helen McDonald Include Me - Specialist Education Services Sarah Hinchey sarah.hinchey@pg.canterbury.ac.nz Kimi Cotter Sarah Hinchey is a PhD candidate at Canterbury University. She is doing a research study on reading comprehension and multisensory integration in autistic children. Sarah is currently recruiting participants aged 8-12 years, autistic and neurotypical, in the Canterbury region and Auckland. The method involves a wireless EEG system that measures the electrical activity in the brain. EEG is a harmless and objective method which can provide crucial information on how these amazing brains process reading material. This will enable the development of a strengths-based reading support strategy specific for autistic learners. If you are interested in taking part you can email Sarah at sarah.hinchey@pg.canterbury.ac.nz . More information can be found at this FB page: UCSpeechLab See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E4 · Fri, June 30, 2023
Episode 4: Beyond the Diagnosis
There is growing awareness and acceptance of neurodivergent profiles like ADHD, autism and dyslexia. But even with a diagnosis, accommodations and support, the world can be an unfriendly place for people whose brains are wired differently. Sonia chats to her guests about the importance of belonging, what ‘bad behaviour’ is really telling us and asks, “does ‘normal’ really exist?” Guests: Jock Matthews Rojolie Clinic Sue Haldane Mind Over Manner Raewyn Heays ADHD NZ Jane Yee Joey Kimi and Ihaka Resources: Dyslexia Foundation of NZ NZ Centre for Gifted Education Autism NZ ADHD NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E3 · Fri, June 23, 2023
Episode 3: Diagnosis.... Or Discovery?
Getting a diagnosis is complicated, and not just because of the long waiting lists. There is so much to consider: Do you want your child – or yourself - to have a label? How will friends and family members react? Is the diagnosis the right one? The process is made more difficult because it’s not an exact science - there is no blood test or scan for ADHD, autism, dyslexia, or any of the other diagnoses. In this episode, Sonia talks to experts who carry out assessments for the various conditions. And we hear from people who have gone through the diagnostic process - and come out the other side. Guests: Ngaire Kartini Clarke Rachel Barrow Mike Hall Lucy Charles paediatricOT Dr Jamie Speeden Growing Pains Anton Ashcroft divergenthinking.co.nz Dr Jemila Chadwick Kidz Therapy Resources: Dyslexia Foundation of NZ NZ Centre for Gifted Education Autism NZ ADHD NZ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E2 · Fri, June 16, 2023
Episode 2: Navigating the System
Trying to navigate the health and education systems is one of the biggest challenges for parents of neurodivergent kids. Where do you start? And where do you go next? We know that early intervention, particularly for Autism and Dyslexia, gives the best chance of a positive outcome. But getting the right support isn’t easy - particularly as parents often don’t know what they are looking for. Sonia chats to her guests about the importance of early intervention, the need for a clear roadmap and how we can reduce the stigma that surrounds neurodiversity. Facebook: Kids Wired Differently Guests: Ngaire and Waiaio Victoria Girling-Butcher Lucy Charles paediatricOT Guy Pope-Mayell Dyslexia Foundation of NZ Justine Munro Neurodiversity in Education Resources: Dyslexia Foundation of NZ NZ Centre for Gifted Education Autism NZ ADHD NZ 4d.org.nz Featured Song: Victoria Girling-Butcher The Giver and the Gift See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
S1 E1 · Fri, June 09, 2023
Episode 1: Different not Disordered
There are 8 billion brains in the world...and they are 8 billion unique brains. We’re all different. So why are neurodivergent conditions (like Autism, ADHD, Dyslexia and Dyspraxia) referred to as disorders? Are they really disorders? Or just different variations of normal? Sonia chats to her guests about the value of neurodiversity, the strengths of unique brains and the challenge of trying to fit into a society that just isn’t built for you. Guests: Dani Rich Rowley brainbadge.org Anton Ashcroft divergenthinking.co.nz Alex Campbell adhdalex.com Lucy Charles paediatricot.nz Scott Robertson (courtesy of Unlocking Potential a documentary by Elliot Jones). Facebook: Kids Wired Differently See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Wed, May 31, 2023
Trailer
No Such Thing as Normal launches June 10th. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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